HBCU vs. PWI
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As many of us are aware, President Obama has been tappin’ (not like that) a lot of people lately for positions within his administration. At this point, we have a Black Male Attorney General in Eric Holder, a Puerto Rican Female Supreme Court Justice in Sonia Sotomayor, and will potentially have a Black Female Surgeon General in Regina Benjamin provided she gets confirmed. Hooray for diversity! Hooray! **Confetti spontaneously appears and starts falling**
Now the first 2, and most high level politicians for that matter, have something in common. They all have roots in Ivy League Schools or Predominantly White Institutions (PWIs). We hear about the Columbia’s, the Princetons, and the Harvards. It’s almost an expectation for anyone being appointed to a position within a Presidential administration to have at least a degree from one of these places of higher learning. But in the case of Regina Benjamin, Barack didn’t adhere to what we would typically expect. I did a little bit of research on Regina and found out that she attended Xavier University of Louisiana and was a member of the 2nd Class of the Morehouse School of Medicine before ultimatley getting her M.D. from the University of Alabama at Birmingham in her home state.
Regina Benjamin in case you haven't seen.
I scratched my head for a second when I read this. I actually thought to myself, “Damn, this is new. Historically Black Colleges and Universities making noise in the upper levels of government? What?” I honestly couldn’t think of a minority off the top of my head in a position of power like that who didn’t attend one of the “prestigious” PWIs for higher education. And yes, that is a problem. Now I’m not saying that a school has to be Ivy League to be prestigious. There are schools/PWIs out there like Duke, Stanford, Emory, and Washington University in St. Louis that have just as powerful a reputation, if not more powerful, than some of the Ivy League schools. Alas, that’s not my focus for today. I got to thinking of the more general issue of PWIs vs. HBCUs.
I went to Cornell University (No Alpha…seriously). I don’t think that puts me in a position to look down on anybody. Do I think the name of my school carries weight? Yes. There was a point where it carried so much weight that I didn’t want to even tell people where I went. For whatever reason, people used to and still sometimes get this look in their eyes and make assumptions about who I am as a person as a result of where I went to school. I’m proud of the education I received and I think it opened some doors for me that I may not have had access to otherwise.
As I look back on my college application process, HBCUs weren’t even an option for me. I knew of Howard, Morehouse, and a few of the others out there. But for me, I wasn’t sure that these schools could help me get where I wanted. I spent grades 7-12 in private white schools where I was one of a handful of “tinted” students. Everyone around me was looking at the PWIs with the guidance counselor, so I did the same. It seemed like the most efficient way to success.
For other folks, HBCUs were and continue to be the only options they’ll consider. They want to be immersed in an environment that promotes their rich cultural heritage. They want to be around students that look like them, talk like them, and understand where they come from. Some PWI campus conservatives would argue that being in that type of environment doesn’t force people to come out of their comfort zones. They would also say that the curriculum at most of these schools isn’t as rigorous as it is at many of the PWIs. I’ve personally read the Princeton Review and seen a lot of the HBCUs get ranked as some of the most poorly run institutions for higher learning. This too is a problem.
Even with all of that said, I know a good number of people that went to HBCUs who are making names for themselves in whatever field they chose to pursue. A good number of which read this blog regularly. Was their overall college experience different than mine? Probably. Do they have a better understanding of the Black/minority experience as a result of where they went to school? Not necessarily. Did they have more functions geared toward Black student life and Black Frats and Sororities? Yes. Definitely. I would think…
It’s hard for me to say too much more about HBCUs because I didn’t attend one and haven’t spent a signficant amount of time on the campus of one. So for today, I want to know what people think on the debate of HBCU vs. PWI? What do you think of your college experience and what do you think some of the main differences are between the two? Does an HBCU put someone at a disadvantage? How about a PWI? Do you wish you went to one or the other in stead? Ahh, so many questions and so little time!
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i went to a hbcu for undergrad as well as for the degree i am currently pursuing. i grew up around black people all my life so when it came time to apply to college i applied to about half hbcus and half pwis. i’ve never once regretted my decision to attend my alma mater. so far i don’t think the school i decided to attend has put me at any type of disadvantage. i attend school with people who graduated from the likes of: harvard, ucla, xavier, morehouse, howard, emory, etc. i really don’t see the difference in performance of students based on what undergraduate institution they attended.
i actually did a blog post about hbcu’s not too long ago:
http://sleep-is-the-cousin-of-death.blogspot.com/2009/04/hbcus.html
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I am a product of a PWI and while sometimes the administration, curriculum, and overall political bs left much to be desired, the people I met and path in life I followed I could never regret.
I always thought HBCUs were like Las Vegas: Great place to visit, but I couldnt live there. I thought I’d have 7 kids and flunk out of school by sophomore year. Obviously that wouldt have been the case (hopefully),but as I meet more and more HBCU graduates I see that their *ahem* process was just as enriching (enrichning?) as mine.
I think the one good advantage of PWIs is that it gives you a glimpse into the real world and not the comfortableness of being around your own with HBCUs. I envy the cultural aspect of HBCUs though. THats so cool to me
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Sowhatiff Jenkins Reply:
July 15th, 2009 at 8:26 am
“I think the one good advantage of PWIs is that it gives you a glimpse into the real world and not the comfortableness of being around your own with HBCUs.”
Word up.
“I envy the cultural aspect of HBCUs though. THats so cool to me.”
Only cuz of the bands and stuff. The marching band at our school was uber lame.
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N.I.A. naturally.... Reply:
July 15th, 2009 at 9:27 am
surely you don’t think African Diasporic culture is just “bands and stuff?” seriously….
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Sowhatiff Jenkins Reply:
July 15th, 2009 at 9:36 am
Of course not. I was highlighting one thing in particular that you don’t find at PWIs. We too have our share of African Diasporic cultural expression.
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Brookland's OWn Reply:
July 15th, 2009 at 8:58 am
“I always thought HBCUs were like Las Vegas: Great place to visit, but I couldnt live there. I thought I’d have 7 kids and flunk out of school by sophomore year.”
Ain’t that the truth, except I don’t think I wouldve even made it to sophmore year. Went to visit Morehouse on a tour of their’s and didn’t pay one lick of attention to the tour guide. There were GRANDMAMA’S out there wit fatty cakes. I might’ve had me a few cougars. Haha
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Single Black Male Reply:
July 15th, 2009 at 11:25 am
Me and my friends always joke that if we had gone to Howard (which was very close) that we would never had graduated. I can’t speak for everyone, but I know at 18-20 … easy p*ssy trumps spending 15 hours in front of a computer programming anyday.
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N.I.A. naturally.... Reply:
July 15th, 2009 at 4:55 pm
dang…no easy p*ssy at your PWI? that sucks…literally….
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@Tunde: co-sign…. Also shoutout to my school XU!!!
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The debate that never ends lol, we all can agree first and foremost that the most important thing about a school is its accreditation. But I have had the experience of attending both in undergrad (started out at a hbcu). I will say imo a hbcu is more nurturing to a student whereas at a pwi more than likely one will deal with race, non existent diversity, and tokenism.
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Aaah yes…the age old argument. I attended an Ivy League institution and loved it. While the cultural experience is one that definitely must be sought out, the PWIs that have a strong community base really make your time there appreciate the solidarity (in the minority community) that might have otherwise been taken for granted. In my case, I became extremely afrocentric LOL. I went to a very diverse public HS and luckily didn’t go into complete culture shock once getting to school which was really helpful seeing that as I pursued/am pursuing more advanced degrees, the Brown faces get more and more sparse.
I can, with 100% certainty say that the school I attended has a great deal to do with where I am now in my professional development. I really wouldn’t have it any other way. I do appreciate the strong sense of brotherhood and sisterhood fostered at HBCUs, and for me, I didn’t feel that part missing in my PWI experience, though that quite possibly could be attributed to my membership in a historically Black sorority (Dr. Regina Benjamin is my Soror and soon to be colleague
). I will say, though, that my friends that attended HBCUs do complain about administrative things like losing applications, calling offices where the employees all seem to be on lunch break, and finicial aid woes; but they also speak about rich heritage, focus on professional development and a true sense of family.
Ultimately, I feel as though both HBCUs and PWI’s exist for a reason…one genre of school is not for everyone. Find your niche, and the place that will be most helpful to you in your own personal endeavors, and excel! Without both perspectives we’d be at a disservice to one another. I know I value my PWI experience and implement the lessons from there daily, and I know the same can be said about my HBCU brothers and sisters.
Sorry so long…
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I attend a PWI. I wanted to go to a HBCU but they were too expensive.
Maybe I am not “corporate” enough, but where someone went to school really doesn’t matter to me. I just admire the fact that you went and finished… This is not easy.
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Nyela Goodness Reply:
July 15th, 2009 at 8:31 am
Wait, I’m confused: An HBCU is more expensive than a PWI?
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Nicki Sunshine Reply:
July 15th, 2009 at 8:49 am
Well, let me rephrase. The PWI I attend is nothing like Princeton or Harvard. lol. It’s just a regular 2520 college.
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Reecie Reply:
July 15th, 2009 at 10:46 am
a lot of private HBCUs are more expensive that state PWIs.
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Raqi Reply:
July 15th, 2009 at 12:29 pm
My PWI costs $40K, $50K with room and board and meal plan. The HBCUs I wanted to attend costs a mere fraction of that. I chose my school because HBCUs didn’t give me any money… so my $50K education cost me significantly less than I would have paid at an HBCU.
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Nyela Goodness Reply:
July 15th, 2009 at 12:46 pm
Word. Shout out to high tuitions with significant financial aid!
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I went to an all black high school, and had NO desire at all to go to an HBCU. When I was applying to colleges, I was asked by teachers and administrators why I wasn’t applying to the Howards and Spelmans of the college world, and simply put, I wanted a different experience than what I had grown used to.
Yeah college is different than high school, but black folks are black folks. While I had my share of issues at my PWI, I feel like I was put in an environment that forced me to learn to adapt to living and working with people who didn’t look, think or grow up like me. Not to say that this can’t happen at an HBCU, but learning to work with a 2520 on a group project is an experience that will undoubtedly happen when one starts to work.
I think HBCU offer an on campus support network that PWI’s don’t. Some people need and seek out that support more than others. Which is fine either way. There are pluses to both, but like Slim, I only know PWIs. But I don’t know that an HBCU would have been for me.
Plus I heard people be going to class dressed up all the time. I need my loan money to go to books and meals, not $200 jeans and want not. haha.
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Slim Jackson Reply:
July 15th, 2009 at 10:10 am
I’ve heard about this dressing up thing and having to look good all the time at HBCUs. Not quite sure how accurate that is, but that sounds kinda lame to me.
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N.I.A. naturally.... Reply:
July 15th, 2009 at 10:26 am
It’s not accurate. Some people dress up some time, which isn’t a bad thing. Personally, I like seeing young adults preparing for the “real world” actually dress the part some times.
I think this “dress up” thing is probably the funniest and silliest complaint I’ve heard about HBCUs. lol…
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Slim Jackson Reply:
July 15th, 2009 at 10:38 am
IDK…chicks having to be done up and all cake-faced up just to be seen in class is different than being suited up and dressed the part for a job. This is a minimal concern though. I agree on that.lol.
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Sowhatiff Jenkins Reply:
July 15th, 2009 at 10:48 am
Yeah, I never heard of it in the sense of people wearing suits and such to class. The phrase I recall is “fashion show.” Just saying what I’ve heard…
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Seattle Washington Reply:
July 15th, 2009 at 11:32 am
I don’t know. I spoke at Howard and the folks’ attire didn’t look any different from my PWI alma mater. There was a mix of chicks in sweats and Uggs as well as bougie chicks that just wanted attention at the library.
Think it also depends on the geography. If you have a HBCU in the South and a PWI in the North, you’re going to see more girls in sweats, without make up and Timbs in the latter than you would in the former.
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N.I.A. naturally.... Reply:
July 15th, 2009 at 1:10 pm
I’ve never been to any college campus, HBCU or PWI, where there weren’t pockets of people who were always dressed for the “fashion show.” And I attended a PWI for law school, and saw it all.
I agree on it being geographical, but I think you can see fashion shows at Southern PWIs as well as Southern HBCUs. Also, at that PWI in the north, are you seeing more black girls in timbs and sweats, or just girls in general? Doesn’t really matter…point is that dressing up, fashion show, whatever you want to call it, is not exclusive to HBCUs specifically, or even black students in colleges and universities generally.
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Ms. Cherry Reply:
July 15th, 2009 at 1:51 pm
I think this is also a generational thing. Not to frown on the class of ‘04 (frowns intensely) but at my PWI, my freshman year, my friends and I were all about sweats, jeans and school para when it came time for class, and so were all the upperclassmen. PJ bottoms, beaters and bubble jackets were all the rage. Then, the next year, all the freshman women came in w/ heels and club gear and I was very confused. Who brings a spandex bodysuit to summer school?
They also messed up the party scene. Used to be dressing up for a party meant you put on a cute top and a pair of thin heeled boots, then all of a sudden girls were showing up at parties w/
fakeGucci visors and matching beltsthat they bought w/ their HEOP refundsand I was baffled. I’m not hating, if that’s what you wanna do, hey do you, but I think the millennials seemed to try to do the most.Even still I think the “fashion show at some HBCUs” is very real. I live in DC and have plenty of friends who went to Howard and like back in 2001 when the whole dirty denim and tan look was out, I felt like I missed the memo when I walked on Howard’s yard. Like every chick had the on the same tan Diba boots w/ dirty denim jeans, and a tan coach bag/belt/hat/sneaks/keyfob. It was a bit much…
I’ve never seen so many designer handbags and Tiffany charm bracelets in my life…
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Seattle Washington Reply:
July 15th, 2009 at 1:55 pm
Oh if you want to see designer handbags and Tiffany charm bracelets, just make your way to a predominant northern PWI and post up right on Sorority/Frat Row. You’ll see more Longchamps, Gucci and Louis Vuitton than on Canal St.
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Ms. Cherry Reply:
July 15th, 2009 at 3:35 pm
Seattle I’m all too aware, but that ish is new. Didn’t used to be that way, or at least people weren’t so garish about it. It’s like the whole car thing… when my sister was in undergrad (early 90s) nobody saved up their HEOP refunds to buy a new car/truck for junior/senior year. South looked more like a used car lot than the Fucillo auto mall that’s going on now.
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This is an interesting topic. I attended a PWI, but for a semester I did domestic exchange at Spelman College. I have to say I definitely regretted not attending an HBCU after that experience.
I always hate when people say that you don’t get to experience diversity if you attend an HBCU. There is sooo much diversity amongst black people alone. That perspective also assumes a white definition of diversity, which is predominantly white with a sprinkling of every other race. As if only predominantly white schools have the capability of being “diverse.” It’s “diverse” for them (white people), but is it really diverse for everyone else? I know the school where I attended there wasn’t much diversity amongst anyone there at all. Yes, there were people of different races and ethnicities, but they all had very similar socio-economic backgrounds, and you would find yourself dealing with the same types of people. We used to say it was “diverse from a distance.” It appeared diverse if you don’t look closely, but upon further inspection, you realize there is no real diversity. Maybe one or two outliers, and the school likes it that way and purposely selects those types of students.
I had a wonderful experience at Spelman. I was really able to compare and felt that I would have had a better undergraduate experience had I attended an HBCU. All the stuff about it not preparing you for the real world always comes from people who have never attended an HBCU. I would argue that you become better prepared because your worth and value is being affirmed as a black person while obtaining an education. You don’t have people telling you whether directly or indirectly that you don’t belong b/c of your color or that you don’t deserve to be where you are. Even if you are not fully aware of it that can have a negative toll in your life and your dealings with people, and that is not preparation for the real world that just beats you down and can make things more difficult. What HBCU’s do whether knowlingly or not is prepares students for the real world by reaffirming the confidence and pride they may already have as black people and just as human beings in general. Some people may have never seen a group of educated black people together in one setting and sometimes that is enough to allow the person to see that they are capable, if not even more so. Others may just want the comfort of wanting to be around other black people who are on their way to success.
Now there were certain administrative things that did not run as smoothly as I would have liked, but overall my experience was wonderful.
I would not use the government jobs/politics as a measure of how successful people from HBCU’s are b/c I know plenty who are extremely successful people and they had great undergraduate/ graduate experiences on top of that. I also noticed that when large companies are looking for their “token” black people, they tend to look at HBCU’s. At least that’s what I noticed at Spelman. I also know a lot of women who graduated from Spelman and then went to Ivy Leagues for post graduate studies, and are doing really well. In my opinion, those people got the best of both worlds: the foundation and then the Ivy degree.
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N.I.A. naturally.... Reply:
July 15th, 2009 at 9:45 am
As a proud Spelman alum, I want to thank you for writing this. I try to avoid getting into this debate b/c the argument on the other side never changes (i’ve heard the same arguments for 10+ years), and it just shows a basic ignorance about HBCUs in general, which is unfortunate.
I’m glad you had such a great experience at Spelman. I also did domestic exchange at Stanford during my junior year…that was th longest year of my life. I’m glad I did it, b/c i was able to see the so-called diversity and the so-called rigorous academics. Let’s just say, I’m glad I’m an alum of a school where diversity is celebrated instead of just tolerated by the majority.
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Remi Reply:
July 15th, 2009 at 10:51 am
You’re welcome.
I agree. I usually try to avoid this conversation too b/c it’s frustrating having this conversation bc it’s usually with people who have never attended an HBCU.
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had to say Reply:
July 15th, 2009 at 11:45 am
“I always hate when people say that you don’t get to experience diversity if you attend an HBCU. There is sooo much diversity amongst black people alone. That perspective also assumes a white definition of diversity, which is predominantly white with a sprinkling of every other race. As if only predominantly white schools have the capability of being “diverse.” It’s “diverse” for them (white people), but is it really diverse for everyone else?”
Amen. We joke that 2520s think all Black people are the same, but in some ways, I think that we perpetuate that as well. Great point!
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Single Black Male Reply:
July 15th, 2009 at 12:12 pm
Sorry … but I kind of agree that there is no diversity at a HCBU. Yeah … sure … we as black folks are all different, but lets be real … that’s not diversity.
My PWI was nice enough to take it serious, and while still mainly 2520s, every race had a major representation along with their own club, week, and cultural shows. I now know more about Indians than I probably ever wanted to.
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CHeeKZ Money Reply:
July 15th, 2009 at 1:18 pm
word… We can’t proclaim diversity by being less diverse. Changing from mocha to Carmel dont count as expanding your horizons. That is like studying aboard in Jersey.
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Seattle Washington Reply:
July 15th, 2009 at 1:20 pm
L M A O.
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Raqi Reply:
July 15th, 2009 at 1:41 pm
SBM: “Sorry … but I kind of agree that there is no diversity at a HCBU. Yeah … sure … we as black folks are all different, but lets be real … that’s not diversity.”
@SBM, I beg to differ. The PWI I attended (Univ. of Chicago) is only 48% Caucasian. My high school in Stone Mountain, GA was probably +/-98% Black, but I am still convinced that it was just as culturally/social/historically/ethnically/racially/economically diverse as was my PWI.
While my high school friends were shades of brown, our histories were colored quite differently. In my “crew” you found Haitian, Ghanaian, Jamaican/Chinese, Jamaican/Indian, Indian, Belize, Ecuadorian, Chilean, Brazilian, Nigerian, Egyptian, Ethiopian, Somalian, Guinean, Zimbabwean, Barbadian … histories; FOB, 1st or 2nd or 3rd generation. We all possessed melanin, but our histories and our cultures and traditions were vastly different.
There is a saying we used to say in my high school as a joke in light of our diversity: “A ni9ga, is a n1g9a, is a n1gg@.” Because race is time and location specific, and we live in America, we are trained in our youth to think like 2520s think, assuming that everything of a certain color belongs to a particular history, which by far is not the case.
Today, my homies are from college. This Friday we (Nigerian (Lagos), 2Jewish(New York, Poland), 2Indian (India/Midwest), 3Black American(2Midwest/1Atlanta), Cuban (Cuba), Mexican(Chicago)) are hanging out, and we are incredibly “diverse” but are more alike than different in many areas, having grown up listening to the same music, reading the same comic books… and their stories don’t differ much from my old high school friends, (except my Cuban friend came over on a raft, no joke.) Apparently “nerd” is universal.
Either way, I certainly hope we don’t actually overlook the fact that brown/black/tan is deeply multifaceted, differing from each other as much as a white man and a black man in the heat of a 1930s Mississippi summer…
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Reecie Reply:
July 15th, 2009 at 1:45 pm
good post Raqi.
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Single Black Male Reply:
July 15th, 2009 at 1:46 pm
While I will agree that the diversity of idea’s, thoughts, social class, etc can be equivalent at both … you simple can’t substitute the diversity of cultures.
While learning the difference between Caribbean and African is good … it still leaves me clueless about Asians or Hispanics.
Simply stated, that exposure to cultures outside of the Diaspora is some real world experience that too many HBCU alums just missed out on.
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Raqi Reply:
July 15th, 2009 at 2:27 pm
@ SBM
Caribbean Islands= ridiculously diverse
Africa= not a country, over 2,000 languages, even more cultures
Ecuadorian, Chilean–> Hispanic Blacks
Jamaican/Chinese, Jamaican/Indian, Indian—> Asian Blacks (I know a few who still speak Hindi and Mandarin)
I’m not saying stop here. I totally see where you are coming from, because there is always more to be desired. But learning about the Diaspora doesn’t happen at our PWIs. You get a Black People Club, an African Black People Club, and a Caribbean Black People club. (A ni9ga, is a n1g9a, is a n1gg@) You get an “African Civ” Class, “Black Political Class”, and “Caribbean Civ” class. (A ni9ga, is a n1g9a, is a n1gg@)
There is always more, I understand that, but don’t discount or underestimate Black.
Just because it looks the same…
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Ms. Cherry Reply:
July 15th, 2009 at 3:43 pm
@ Raqi
But learning about the Diaspora doesn’t happen at our PWIs.
Maybe not at some PWIs but definitely at mine, be it through academics or socially. African American History was different from African Politics (which was two separate courses), which was different from the class on Black Immigrant Domestic Workers. There’s three separate study abroad programs to learn about the diaspora from European, Carribean and African prospectives…
My PWI was on point
** looks up at random school para hanging by the PC w/ pride**
lol
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Raqi Reply:
July 15th, 2009 at 4:35 pm
@Ms Cherry
I misspoke. We learned quite a bit too, but our AFAM Dept was/is still growing… Twas quite young…
Oh, and “African” Politics is the same clumping I was talking about- we had one of those… its the comparison to France Politics or China Politics that Im talking about though: discussing a country versus clumping a continent.
(I would have LOVED to take Black Immigrant Domestic Workers. Would you mind being a dork and posting the reading list… lol (semi serious… no but really?))
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Remi Reply:
July 15th, 2009 at 4:21 pm
@SBM: That is not diversity. I went to a PWI in the Boston Metro area, so I know all about the groups and orgs, and I have to say it is just a front b/c the people were all the same, whether white, black, or whatever. Just b/c you are in a white atmosphere and there are a few “others” who cling together does not mean that diversity exists.
Diversity is not just about color, it’s about your entire background and whether people mix together. Where I went to school and what I witnessed on the PWI campuses of my other friends is that there was what I mentioned above “diversity at a distance.” There were the groups and orgs (I was VP of one and very active on my campus), but I did feel there was any diversity. The black people were the as same as the white people, and the asians, latinos, the international students, etc. And to top it off, really did not mingle with each other.
It’s also foolish to assume that attending an HBCU will prevent you from being exposed to other ethnicities b/c America is full of other races and colors and I don’t know anyone besides a white person who can live in the US without being exposed or aware of other races at some point in their lives.
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miss jess Reply:
July 15th, 2009 at 1:36 pm
I Cosign this entire comment. I transferred to a pretty prestigous PWI from and HBCU, and honestly, the diversity of thought and ideas was often times greater at the HBCU. Possibly because students were more comfortable sharing openly with each other without the racial barriers. Added to that the idea of affirming the worth of one’s own blackness, the HBCU experience was definitely a valuable one.
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Raqi Reply:
July 15th, 2009 at 1:42 pm
lol, hey Ship, You not working either, eh???
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miss jess Reply:
July 15th, 2009 at 1:48 pm
Ha! I’m sure not…lol…im gonna start tho…after lunch.
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MaPockets Reply:
July 15th, 2009 at 1:59 pm
“I would argue that you become better prepared because your worth and value is being affirmed as a black person while obtaining an education. You don’t have people telling you whether directly or indirectly that you don’t belong b/c of your color or that you don’t deserve to be where you are.”
I kinda disagree with this point. No one ever told me at my PWI that I didn’t belong. If anything, I was welcomed with more grants, scholarships, and special privileges than anyone else I know. Open doors, open hearts, open minds (lol). I must admit that there was the occasional conservative newspaper article that made cruel or ignorant accusations/jokes against the Black community. But I’ve also attended events at HBCU and have been cracked on b/c of my Northern accent or accused of thinking I was better than the students there b/c I was from a PWI. I think there is a direct/indirect forced feeling of segregation/inferiority no matter where you go…you’re just more likely to experience the feeling you’ll get in the real world…at a PWI…which I argue makes you more prepared for said real world.
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Remi Reply:
July 15th, 2009 at 4:32 pm
@MaPockets – I disagree. I actually found the world to be much less hostile than the PWI that I attended. In general a university is not a “real” atmosphere, but to say that being at a PWI is more like the real world is simply false. At least where I attended there were a bunch of rich kids (regardless of race) who didn’t know how to act, did not have manners, and were very out of touch with the world outside of themselves and their wealthy friends. The world is definitely not filled with a whole bunch of rich people, they make a very small part of the population. I felt I got more of a real world experience at Spelman b/c although the people there were mostly black (not all), I met people with a variety of backgrounds and experiences who I never would have encountered at the PWI I attended.
I grew up in a predominantly latino and black neighborhood, I went to a predominantly white high school, and I’m from RI, which is pretty friggin white. And I have to say at Spelman I saw the most diversity I have ever seen. People freely expressed ideas, were free to be themselves, and were from all walks of life. I can’t say the same about the PWI, I attended. It definitely was nothing like the real world. It was not like the law school I attended, which although law school sucks, I had a much better experience and I work with people who are more like the people at Spelman, than the PWI I attended.
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I went to Florida State the white party school of the south. When I tell you I bleeeeeed Garnet and Gold! You can say what you want about our cheating football team (yea* that’s right, I said it. Best believe they all cheat!) but we had a good time at FSU. Partying with white people is the most cost-efficient and hilarious thing you can do.
Oh… education. Well, in the South we don’t get much love for our Academics, but FSU is actually a great institution and many of our programs are highly ranked. There were some lapses in the system, such as career development (I know this is pretty huge, but you really have to work you’re ass off through their system to get a good job. But it’s highly possible. I did) but overall it was an amazing experience. Like someone above said, the minorities pretty much banded together. We ran the school. We were in all of the top positions on campus, board of trustees, homecoming court, all of that.
I never considered an HBCU. We at least not for good reasons. I wanted to go to FAMU to dance, but you can do that even if you go to FSU. Having FAMU across the tracks (literally. Sucks, I know) was great because it was like having the best of both worlds.
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Berriblk Reply:
July 19th, 2009 at 12:46 am
One time for the Noles!!
So true @ Partying with white people…
SMDH
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Slim, I still hate telling people where I went to school. The look that overcomes their face is too much, sometimes. Sometimes I just want them to get to know me first. I’ve even had situations where our conversation is going along GREAT until they ask where I go to school and suddenly it’s “oh…” and that’s basically the end of the conversation. I hate it.
Having said that, I also am more and more happy with my choice in university with every passing year (since graduation). I made the best choice for me and it shows both in my achievements while there and my eagerness to be involved post-graduation (the same can’t be said for all my black friends who went to this university)
I hate when I’m asked why I didn’t go to or apply to an HBCU. I looked at a lot of them, but many of them had things about them (curfews for freshmen, dress codes, etc…) that I just couldn’t get down with. I know that HBCUs are wonderful for a lot of our college-bound folks, but they’re not right for all of us and I wish we all could understand that and accept it instead of forever being in the PWI vs HBCU conversation. They’re different and so shouldn’t be compared as if one is better than the other.
I didn’t pledge while at my school but we had a fairly thriving NPHC presence (perhaps in part because of our crazy close proximity to two HBCUs; they were literally across the railroad tracks, and yes I’m aware of all the allusions there) so I do wonder about the difference that makes for the black folk at a PWI vs an HBCU…
Like others have said, all the black folks were friend from almost jump. One thing I can say I had as an advantage over all the white folks was that I didn’t have to try hard to figure out where I fit in or make friends. The older black students facilitated a lot of “togetherness” and there were other nuances and things we came to quickly understand that pulled us together. That doesn’t mean everybody liked it or that all the black kids fit in (they didn’t) but it was good for me and I know I wouldn’t have had that at an HBCU (though I’m fully aware HBCUs are good at fostering the familial feel — but we’re still talking about a familial feel amongst hundreds (maybe thousands) of individuals vs just a handful…)
I should add, though, that of course where there are white people (especially in the South sometimes) there will be racial issues and we had a lot of those. That sucked, but I can say having those experiences has helped me in so much stuff post-graduation. That exposure can be great, but also harsh for anyone who may not be ready for it…
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I feel particularly qualified to join in this debate because I grew up on an HBCU (like I actually lived ON campus from age 8 to 18), but I went to a “PWI” for undergrad and a “P…NW…I” for grad school. Thanks for the shout out, but EMORY is actually NOT predominately white. It’s majority minority, which is actually where I’m going with this.
As much as I loved my BIG COLLEGE experience at THE PENNSYLVANIA STATE UNIVERSITY and as much as I loved growing up with the bands, step shows, and black cultural extravaganzas at VIRGINIA STATE UNIVERSITY, I think the best experience (as fas as student life is concerned) I had was at Emory. Because there IS something diluted and single-minded about “predominately black” colleges in that they’re NOT what the rest of the corporate and/or real world looks like. And there’s also something ignorant and dismissive about “predominately white” colleges in that they tend to designate certain places and groups for their minority students, and don’t really give opportunities for everyone else to learn and share in those cultures. At every black event, nothing but black people. And hispanic events, nothing but Latinos. Asians, Indians, whites – with the exception of football games, even LUNCH tables are segregated at PWI’s.
There’s something to be said about institutions where you walk into a classroom and you’re NOT the only person of color; where, in fact, you’re not the same color as everyone else either. Before Emory, I didn’t even know it was possible to NOT have to serve as the representation of all blacks, all Hispanics, all “non-whites”… or all “non-blacks”.
Diversity is something that cannot be underestimated – it is what gives us a more well-rounded perspective with which to live and have an understanding of other people’s cultures. We are better people for it. Before Emory, I was completely naive (and prejudice) to the cultures of Asians, Indians, Muslims, and just foreigners in general. But being forced to encounter each of these cultures on a daily basis, I know so much more – so much beyond my classroom education – and I’m thankful for it.
And the beautiful thing about it is, Emory is still a top ranked school, despite that everyone else in the world seems to think diversity (particularly involving black people, and yes, there are PLENTY of black people at Emory) equals lowered standards of quality, and that’s clearly not always the case.
More schools should be like that. Until then, the important thing is that we encourage our younger generations to ACHIEVE higher education, regardless where they do it.
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Reecie Reply:
July 15th, 2009 at 10:38 am
Joey, are you from the Burg? I went to VSU, and loved every moment of it! I applied to a handful of PWIs (only locally) but I always wanted to attend a HBCU. My distant family has attended almost every HBCU in NC and I wanted to continue that tradition. I ended up staying in state for money reasons, but I’m sooo glad I did! I worked with other races while in college, interned with them, etc. so I never felt isolated. I attended a PWI for graduate school and that was enough for me. I’m glad some people realize some experiences may not have been for them, but you really don’t know if you never did an exchange like the lady above or attended both.
oh and oo-oop to my soror LilBrownGirl!
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Joey Reply:
July 15th, 2009 at 11:36 am
Yes, Reecie, I am from the ‘Burg… Good to hear I got some fellow TROJANS out there!! And also glad you loved every moment at VState… I’ll let Pres. Moore know.
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Reecie Reply:
July 15th, 2009 at 11:39 am
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I refused to even apply to a PWI until my mama made me and I applied to one far far far away, lol. I’ve gone to “diverse” schools my whole life and I’m kinda tired of the argument ‘that being in that type of environment doesn’t force people to come out of their comfort zones’ if you attend an HBCU……what America do you live in? lol. In most high powered fields whose face are you going to see most.
How many times have you heard “I’m the only black woman/man in my office”? I know I’ve said it plenty of times and my field isn’t that exclusive. So, what does attending a HBCU or PWI have to do with that?
You’d best believe that I’m a proud Pirate (QT4 baby!!)..my only regret was Hampton was too damn small. I partied my behind off but so did my fiance who went to UMBC, lol. Your college experience is what you make it….besides there’s always grad school, lol.
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Tunde Reply:
July 15th, 2009 at 11:22 am
people at umbc party? wow. who would have thought? lol
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Ms. Cherry Reply:
July 15th, 2009 at 1:53 pm
lmao!!! you’re so wrong for that, but so right!
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Smiley Face Reply:
July 15th, 2009 at 6:42 pm
lol..trust..there were a many of drunken phone calls made b/c of that juice they were servin’ ,lol
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I think higher learning is important for black folk. To me, it doesn’t matter where you go, really. You could go to SUNY Cobbleskill for all I care… as long as you learn in the environment and better yourself, you’re doing the right thing…
yeah, i went to a powerhouse pwi, but i’ll never look down my nose on anyone. i dunno.. maybe it’s my career choices.. whether i went to cornell or compton community college, i feel like i’d be on the same path i’m on now…
- guns!!
ps – i don’t know if i cudda gone to a hbcu… where would i find white girls? (j/k………. kinda.)
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CHeeKZ Money Reply:
July 15th, 2009 at 9:39 am
Why did you throw Cobbleskill under the bus!?
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Guns & Butter Reply:
July 15th, 2009 at 9:52 am
inside joke.. b/w me and slim.
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Slim Jackson Reply:
July 15th, 2009 at 10:12 am
Yes. Sorry Cheekz. Fredonia is also part of it.lol.
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CHeeKZ Money Reply:
July 15th, 2009 at 10:33 am
SUNY haters.
Those schools are decent…naw, I’m just playing. Tompkins Cortland looks like a prison.
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I attended PWI’s for both undergrad and grad school and I wouldn’t change that for anything. I grew up in a college town, so diversity was always a part of my life. My dad is extremely Pro-Black, so I grew up with a deep understanding of my history, people, and culture, so I didn’t feel like I needed to be in a HBCU environment to get those things (not knocking anybody who does need that, I’m just saying I got started on that education earlier in life). I had an extremely well-rounded collegiate experience, made friends for life, learned a whole lot, and made a ton of contacts.
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I went to a white historic high school. I really REALLY got sick of those damn 2520 asking me to grow an afro and wanting my opinion on Soul Train episodes.
It was horrible. All Boys at that.
When the decision came around to chosing which colleges to apply to I told those white kids I wanted to get away from them and go to Howard or Morehouse. They looked at me like I told them I wanted to professionally take crack for a living. They pulled out their Princeton review books and ask me if I had done any research besides the percentage of girls to guys?
I applied to those Ivy’s the next day. I ended up transfer to another state PWI, but still feel the Ivy networking impact. I don’t know if the other schools can really match that. I have heard of people going on interviews and 2520s asking where their alma mater is located? That aint happening to a kid that went to Notre Dame or Villanova.
My girl is going for her PHD, I almost broke up with her when she suggested going to a ‘normal school’. I’m with her for the prestige. I got a normal diploma, I need a woman my mother can brag about.
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Guns & Butter Reply:
July 15th, 2009 at 9:46 am
aye!!
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CHeeKZ Money Reply:
July 15th, 2009 at 10:02 am
I’m Booming, I’m Banking
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Guns & Butter Reply:
July 15th, 2009 at 10:04 am
barney barney, we servin’ up some barney!!
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CHeeKZ Money Reply:
July 15th, 2009 at 10:18 am
Young JuiceMan put your water on my plate.
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Joey Reply:
July 15th, 2009 at 11:39 am
yall are so out of control!!
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had to say Reply:
July 15th, 2009 at 11:55 am
Cheekz…..
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I went to an Ivy and loved it! I think no less of a HBCU than any other school of Higher Ed—it just wasn’t for me. I’m from Florida, so most of my fam went to FAM(U).lol Certainly, where I am now, is contributed—in large part—to the connections I made and the learning experienced at my PWI. There’s no need in sugarcoating the fact that I was more concerned with accreditation and financial resources and support than “enriching my
blackcultural experience.”The irony of it all is that I became more aware of my Blackness at a PWI. I became the only Brown face in many of my classes and work groups. In a place where true diversity is scarce, there’s, fittingly, a heightened need for and presence of minority-based groups and orgs. What’s funny, though, is that there was always this theme of “We shall overcome,” no matter how good we had it and no matter how many barriers were broken from our efforts. Once you become immersed in that world, it’s just as easy to limit your company to those who look like you as it is at a HBCU.
In essence, the “real world” is what you make it and your experiences are limited only by what your mind allows—this, no matter what type of institution you attend.
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N.I.A. naturally.... Reply:
July 15th, 2009 at 10:01 am
In essence, the “real world” is what you make it and your experiences are limited only by what your mind allows—this, no matter what type of institution you attend.
my sentiments exactly
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JG* Reply:
July 15th, 2009 at 10:14 am
Same here. I got SUPER militant from going to a PWI. Prior to that, I was the token negro. I think if I had gone to an HBCU I would have hated it. Like I said, we had one right across the street, so I had the best of both worlds. There were things that were just OD to me though. The curfews, the rules, etc.
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Guns & Butter Reply:
July 15th, 2009 at 10:11 am
“What’s funny, though, is that there was always this theme of “We shall overcome,” no matter how good we had it and no matter how many barriers were broken from our efforts. Once you become immersed in that world, it’s just as easy to limit your company to those who look like you as it is at a HBCU.”
I wasn’t mad at that tho… i thought it was good that the community could band together when the institution or WPs were doin’ some greasy shit against us.. it was like our backs were against the wall vs. “the man”. made me feel all revolutionary and shit…. but as much as i loved the strong community aspect (tho we did have our issues) i still never limited myself.
- g&b
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CHeeKZ Money Reply:
July 15th, 2009 at 10:16 am
FREE KEN GLOVER!
Uj for live…. even though I never lived there.
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MaPockets Reply:
July 15th, 2009 at 2:04 pm
LOL! the man is NOT in prison.
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Nyela Goodness Reply:
July 15th, 2009 at 10:22 am
I definitely appreciated our ability to band together and fight the “otha” folk for change. WP did some shady stuff (still do – e.g., KG Uj issue), but there were people who felt like it was ALWAYS necessary to “fight,” even when there was no adversary or no sensible reason for action. These same people who fought for inclusiveness, never thought it necessary to expand our community to those not already within it. That’s just not the right approach IMO.
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CHeeKZ misses 804 E State St Reply:
July 15th, 2009 at 10:44 am
Might have to Co-sign this one.
We were like the French the way we wanted to protest. Sometimes I would come to a rally only to find out that I really wasn’t that offended by the incident.
But I personally feel black people protest too much much in general, you can’t blame the Nell for that. We got too much Sharpton in us. I think it was fair to say that there were those that wanted to turn Uj into Howard. They didn’t want to reach out and they wonder why Sigma Nu wouldn’t let them into the School Girl Outfit party (am I getting my WB frats confused?).
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I attended an Ivy League school. Go Quakers!!! (Pause) I didnt look at HBCU’s b/c they lacked the things that I were interested. I wanted to go to a school where I could play high quality football and get a great education. IMHO you cant do that at an HBCU. The sports and many of the extracurriculars are in many cases severely underfunded.
I always was told by a councelor at my PWI that an A at Harvard is an A at Howard is an A at Borough of Manhattan Community College. But a C+ at Harvard doo-doo’s all over a C+ at the other two.
Also, Howard & Spelman & Morehouse & sometimes FAMU & a few others are legititmately good schools. What about the rest of HBCU’s? I dont know.
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Peyso was blocked from 3 ways for 2 weeks Reply:
July 15th, 2009 at 10:46 am
Plus you cant have no good football team without a crazy white boy
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College is not so much about what you know, but who you know. And once you get that degree it’s all about what you use it for. You can be a trailblazer if you went to an HBCU or a PWI. I think people usually pick the best fit for them. For some it’s a HBCU, others a PWI.
I thought I wanted to go to FAMU until my junior year in high school. I went there for a two-week journalism camp and realized I hated the place. I applied to the University of Florida with the quickness.
Of course there were the haters who thought I was ashamed of my blackness because I didn’t want to attend an HBCU. I have nothing but mad love for them, but I knew FAMU would bring me down with its atmosphere.
I’m proud to be a Black Gator Grad. Going to UF was the best choice for me. I might not have had the complete “black experience,” but I don’t feel like I was lacking it either. Sure there was racism, but that’s in the real world too. I think I was also able to stay focused more on school then partying. UF is one of the top party schools , if you’re white. Not so much for black people. Ultimately, I got a great education, and I’m sure my HBCU counterparts did too.
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RightCoastLexSteele, Pompous Snob Reply:
July 15th, 2009 at 11:49 am
“College is not so much about what you know, but who you know. And once you get that degree it’s all about what you use it for.”
Chuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuch!
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As an attendant of a well (enough) ranked state PWI, I actually am a huge supporter of PWIs. I don’t knock anyone for going to an HBCU and they have produced some excellent people.
The one time I am actually against HBCUs is for people who grew up in a very strong black culture and environment. I have met a few HBCU grads who, for lack of a better word, just can’t deal with white people. Everything offends them, there is this unneeded aggression towards them, yet they’re not super militant or anything. When I do come across em … always gives HBCUs some negative points.
Overall though, I’m boughie. I’m just for good schools. When it comes time for SBM jr to figure out what school he is gonna go too, as long as its not homeboy university, it can be a PWI or HBCU.
Oh … and one thing … I am convinced any black women has a 50% greater chance of getting turned the f*ck out at an HBCU. I know … I shouldn’t think that … but I had friends at Howard. If I was there, would never have studied and SBM jr might already be here with me.
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Slim Jackson Reply:
July 15th, 2009 at 10:54 am
Agreed my blogging brethren, agreed. The s*xual appetite seems to be well-fed at HBCUs, which can cause an even more thorough screening of the resume which it comes to finding a boo. Now I’m not saying all Black/Latina women who go to HBCUs are smeezes, but I’m willing to bet a much larger percentage of them become…well….ummm, ya know.
I think 6 new partners at a PWI is 12 at an HBCU
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RightCoastLexSteele, Pompous Snob Reply:
July 15th, 2009 at 11:34 am
Hold up. Now THIS is asinine, for the simple fact that at a PWI, the hoes can hide. A chick can go to a white frat house @ PWI, be the all the whore she can be, non the wiser to the “black community”. I’d venture to say @ a HBCU, the close knit community knows who all the hoes are.
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CHeeKZ Money Reply:
July 15th, 2009 at 10:56 am
There is a new tape on the internet of what will happen to your daughter if she goes to Morgan St….. lmao! Don’t google it @ Work, repeat NSFW!
Seems like taking on three guys is part of the core curriculum. Good teamwork.
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Single Black Male Reply:
July 15th, 2009 at 10:59 am
You have got to provide a link … girls at Morgan State has been a hotly debated topic with me and someone for months!!!
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Slim Jackson Reply:
July 15th, 2009 at 11:11 am
I’ve been to Morgan State before…can’t really talk about it. But I have been there.lol.
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Slim Jackson Reply:
July 15th, 2009 at 11:13 am
Yo, I just looked at who this and I know the chick….OMG.
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CHeeKZ Money Reply:
July 15th, 2009 at 11:37 am
slim? How are you checking Ye at work? Its 11:28 in the morning.. you have an addiction sir. And coming from me that means alot.
SingleBlack.. I’m don’t think slim wants us posting pornye on here … but I will send him the link to send to you.
Morgan State = Scandal!
There are 2 tapes! One with one chick, the other is a compliation. Morgan St… making alumni proud!
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Peyso was blocked from 3 ways for 2 weeks Reply:
July 15th, 2009 at 11:52 am
put me on the morgan state sex scandal list serve please & thanks
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Ms. Cherry Reply:
July 15th, 2009 at 2:00 pm
For those of us who grew up in the DMV this is not news, just confirmation of what some of us already knew. I don’t even want to look cause I prob went to high school w/ said chick.
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Tunde Reply:
July 15th, 2009 at 11:30 am
gtfohwts…
like chicks at PWIs don’t get ran through. shit look at girls gone wild. i wonder how many of those chicks attended HBCUs.
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Joey Reply:
July 15th, 2009 at 11:43 am
I think the point is that *black* women are more likely to get turned out at HBCU’s. White women are turned out everywhere. Hehe.
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Tunde Reply:
July 15th, 2009 at 11:55 am
the point should be that if a women has the propensity to get turned out it can happen anywhere. a hbcu is not going to increase those odds. but for the sake of the argument a white women’s odds of getting turned out won’t also increase at a PWI?
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Peyso was blocked from 3 ways for 2 weeks Reply:
July 15th, 2009 at 11:43 am
this point is moot and mute b/c we only talkin about the tinted women not the pink toes
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Tunde Reply:
July 15th, 2009 at 11:55 am
why aren’t we talking about white women? do they not also attend college?
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When I was a junior in high school I made my own decision to go to a private PWI. I didn’t apply to an HBCU for the same reason I didn’t apply to an Art/Design School – I wanted diversity.
I wanted to be around folks that had no idea what Design principles were. I wanted to meet folks that were nowhere near from where I was from, geographically and other ways as well. I wanted to be able to have the quintessential college experience not just be around artsy folks all day. I thought that would enrich my experience and prepare me for post-college. I didn’t think being around Black people, or any one set of people for that matter, constantly would get me ready for the real world where things are more heterogeneous. Especially in my field.
Plus I wanted to go to a well-recognized program for my field and, unfortunately, an HBCU didn’t have that. I’m sure if I went into something else may be an HBCU would’ve showed up on my radar.
Can’t knock anyone that did go to an HBCU, just wasn’t for me. It’s all about what you want to get into and out of college.
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LoudPen Reply:
July 15th, 2009 at 1:13 pm
Why is that an HBCU doesn’t have diversity? Really, how can you as a person that has NEVER ACTUALLY attended an HBCU say that? Really how? I’m confused.
There is plenty of diversity at HBCUs. Just because the school is all black doesn’t make it less diverse. It’s that it’s a different type of diversity. I went to Hampton (shout out to the real HU) and I met people that were so different from me that I had to make sure we were both black.
I’m from the burbs of Ohio so of course, I think about things differently than someone from Harlem or D.C. In Ohio, we drive cars and play football. On the East Coast, most people ride public transportation (esp. NYers), but in Ohio if you took the bus you were broke and couldn’t afford a car. (The buses don’t run everywhere and stop at like 10 or 11pm). Most NYers prefer b-ball over football.
And what about the people that I met that were from Cali? They were usually very chilled and liked to smoke trees. Then there were the sweet southern folk who were always frying the best chicken. So you see, we were diverse and I experienced all this at an HBCU. Black people need to stop thinking that there is one black experience and that’s all you will get at an HBCU.
There’s a difference b/t each group I named, and if you don’t know it then I don’t know what to tell you.
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Seattle Washington Reply:
July 15th, 2009 at 1:34 pm
You’re right. Diversity isn’t racial, it’s cultural. It is great to meet other Black folks from various parts of the globe, but we had that at PWIs as well. I’ve got my Ace from SC who talks with the stereotypical drawl, my friends that compile the African Connection, my boys straight from the islands, my dudes from Cali and my fellow New Yorkers. They all gave me various perspectives and insights that I never had before. That’s definitely not relegated to an HBCU.
But when it comes to “diversity”, I think that those friendships you’ve listed are wonderful, but could only be bettered by developing relationships with people like the Eskimo kid from Alaska, the Indian girl from Florida, the White cat from Nor Cal or any of the other many non-Blacks that attended my PWI.
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LoudPen Reply:
July 15th, 2009 at 3:29 pm
You make a good point also. You do get to experience/befriend the Eskimo Kid fro Alaska, the Indian girl from Florida, and the white cat from North Cali at the PWI. But, how many did you experience and befriend and actually stay friends with?
It’s great to meet and befriend different people, but, I feel like you gotta know your own first.
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Seattle Washington Reply:
July 15th, 2009 at 3:50 pm
I still keep in contact with some of the non-Black friends I made in college. Like anybody else, I stay in touch with those worth keeping in touch with.
I’ve got my core friends, most of which are a part of the “African diaspora” (term of the day).
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Nyela Goodness Reply:
July 15th, 2009 at 1:35 pm
While I wouldn’t go as far as Seattle in saying HBCUs aren’t diverse, I wouldn’t say that my seeking diversity could be fulfilled at a HBCU, based on what you defined as it being diverse. Meeting different types of Black people, from all around the country, with different perspectives is certainly diverse; I won’t knock that. But when I think of the diversity that my PWI afforded, I think of the chick I met from New Zealand, the dude I know from Singapore, and the Professor I encountered from Zimbabwe. Even my black friends have diversity among them beyond characteristics and domestic location: They’re from Nigeria, Haiti, Ghana, etc. These cultural differences and encounters allowed for a more global perception of diversity, not merely a domestic one.
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CHeeKZ Money Reply:
July 15th, 2009 at 1:41 pm
I know an Tatoo’d Indian who plays football, is a praticing buddist and urinates on cop cars… with the cop still in it. He is now a praticing lawyer…. I’m sorry but you can’t find that at an HSBCU.
The kind of diversity you describe we have.. met all those black people, but what about the rest of the world.
Going back to Seatle’s point, what about the lack of programs? I’m not saying you guys didn’t have anything… just not as much. The size of those schools alone speak to their limits.
No asians and their pill popping? No crazy white boy parties? No tree huggers and their au natural scent?? Have you ever seen Road Trip? Animal House? PCU? That is what we are talking about….
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Seattle Washington Reply:
July 15th, 2009 at 1:46 pm
Exactly. Nothing like drinking beers with one White frat one night and then almost getting into a racially fueled fight with some other members of the IFC at a later time.
Whew. I miss college. Road trip anyone?!
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MaPockets Reply:
July 15th, 2009 at 2:09 pm
Ok, then let’s start calling it what it really is then. An HBCU has very little, if any, racial diversity…which IMHO is NOT a plus in an educational environment…ever. There you have it. A PWI 9.99 times out of ten will have more racial diversity than an HBCU. Now…whether that diversity is always celebrated/respected/recognized/whatever…is a different story.
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This argument is worse than:
1) iPhone vs. BlackBerry
2) Kobe vs. LeBron
3) Who has better alumni? Alpha vs. Que
It just never ends. And to me this converation is like the argument around “pledging”. Why put so much focus on how you become a graduate? Doesn’t it matter what you do after you graduate that matters?
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Slim Jackson Reply:
July 15th, 2009 at 11:19 am
I don’t think it’s a bad argument at all. I think the readership here operates at a certain level of intellect that it doesn’t need to get OD. There is no resolution to the questions or discussion, it’s just an open forum for thoughts. And quite honestly, I haven’t seen it discussed in any blog that I’ve read over the last 6 months.
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RightCoastLexSteele, Pompous Snob Reply:
July 15th, 2009 at 11:29 am
I can answer two of those!
1. Blackberry
2. Kobe
I’d answer #3, but since 1 out of every 9 Que’s that cross graduate, uh…I have no stats.
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Raqi Reply:
July 15th, 2009 at 6:07 pm
Actually, the Bruhz have a pretty high graduation rate nationally… Maybe the ones at your college didn’t, but that probably has something to do with YOUR school… tehehe
Don’t hate on MY Bruhz… homie…
Oh! and uhhh…. Black Berry, Kobe!
lol
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RightCoastLexSteele, Taking my glaucoma medicine Reply:
July 15th, 2009 at 7:50 pm
That was inside joke. But I’m sorry to be hating on YOUR bruhz.
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Wow *scratch a temple* so many stereotypes, so little time…smh
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Ok, so I’d be lying if I said I didnt feel a I have a leg up on folks cuz I went to a PWI, and a D1 school at that. I didnt wear it on my sleeve until I started runnning into HBCU cats that felt that they were better than me cuz they went to a HBCU…somehow that puts them better in tune w/ black culture and the African Diasporic culture. First off, WTF is African Diasporic culture? Can anyone actually tell me that? Second, how does going to a HBCU put you better in touch w/ it…cuz you went to school w/ a bunch of other negroes that have no idea what African Diasporic culture is? Puuuuhlease.
I’m sure there’s nothing wrong with an HBCU education, but the people I’ve met that it produces, I’m sooo not impressed. I understand that a lot of these school were started because PWI’s wouldn’t let black folks rock at that time, but like most things, their original purpose and mission have been lost. Please believe Lex Jr. and his sister Alexia will be going to a PW *private* school, at least for college.
Maxwell Mafia- “We Run Government”
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ASmith Reply:
July 15th, 2009 at 11:30 am
And here’s my lone bone with some HBCU alums. They speak to me as if they are better than me because they attended an HBCU. Because of my school’s proximity to two other HBCUs we had tons of contact with them (mostly when we had parties….) anyway, there was a constant tension there…
Eventually we had a panel discussion and it came to light that they were intimidated by our campus and while it was only alluded to, I’m sure their “air of arrogance” came mostly from trying to beat our “air of arrogance” even though I feel comfortable in saying a lot of us went out of our way not to have it.
I try to always say — I went to the school that was right for me. It wasn’t right for me because it wasn’t an HBCU, it was right for me because of what it was and what it offered. I imagine the same goes for those who went to HBCUs and loved it. In fact, it’s about the individual school. Going to one HBCU and loving it doesn’t mean you would’ve loved another, and the same goes for PWIs…
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CHeeKZ Money Reply:
July 15th, 2009 at 11:41 am
Did you go to Duke? B/c from what I hear there is alot of tension between yall and your HSBCUs. You play lax?
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ASmith Reply:
July 15th, 2009 at 11:44 am
I went to a far higher ranked school than Duke. I’m insulted…..
Wow… tough crowd…
Ok, no, I didn’t go to Duke, I went to Vanderbilt.
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Tunde Reply:
July 15th, 2009 at 11:35 am
“I’m sure there’s nothing wrong with an HBCU education, but the people I’ve met that it produces, I’m sooo not impressed.”
~something about this statement rubs me the wrong way (pause). i wonder what it is about the people you’ve met that caused you to be unimpressed. also, i’m pretty sure a lot of people could say the say the same things about you or anyone else who attended a PWI.
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RightCoastLexSteele, Pompous Snob Reply:
July 15th, 2009 at 11:41 am
I’m very impressive. Very.
But I digress. I have a very close friend that went to a HBCU, and when schools come up, he usually says, “I went to Morehouse- a real school”. It never fails. Maybe it’s the people I know/have met, but they all leave a bad taste in my mouth. Yea, pause.
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Tunde Reply:
July 15th, 2009 at 11:58 am
oh shit. you should have said that in the first place. guys who attended morehouse also leave a leave a bad taste in mouth (pause). they are very snobish and look down their noses at everyone (HBCUs as well as PWIs). so don’t think that this is the attitude of ALL people who attended HBCUs. morehouse men are a different breed.
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Smiley Face Reply:
July 15th, 2009 at 12:15 pm
I get the same reaction from (some of) the PWIers..”Oh you went to Hampton (pause) interesting” all said while I can see their nostril hair.
Am I impressed you get into and excelled at Princeton or Yale..sure that’s nice, but don’t discredit me (especially since we went to the same high school and I got better grades than you so nah) b/c I chose not to apply to those schools, that’s all I’m saying.
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Seattle Washington Reply:
July 15th, 2009 at 11:40 am
You ever see the South Park episode where all of South Park was covered in “smug” from the folks that were bougie b/c they were driving their hybrid cars?
That’s exactly the feeling I get from some HBCU alum. Could it be overcompensation because they didn’t go to a “mainstream”, well-known private or Ivy league school? Perhaps. Could it be that they were told every day that they were special because there were attending an HBCU? Plausible as well.
Either way, whenever I meet someone that’s graduated from an HBCU and I tell them I went to my well-known private PWI, I get abruptly met with some kind of arrogance.
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CHeeKZ Money Reply:
July 15th, 2009 at 11:44 am
my baby cuz graduated from Morehouse this year, the whole cermony they were trying to brainwash me about how special being a Morehouse Man was… and how much they had to be great because they owe it to the institution. We never talked like that up north.
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Seattle Washington Reply:
July 15th, 2009 at 11:52 am
Yeah, but can they say they saw their college win a National Championship, partied all night and almost joined the rioting? I think not!!!
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Single Black Male Reply:
July 15th, 2009 at 12:09 pm
Seattle … did we go to the same school???
I def didn’t join the rioting … but I was right there while the fire roared.
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RightCoastLexSteele, Pompous Snob Reply:
July 15th, 2009 at 12:32 pm
That was a good year. Cops let parties rock cuz they knew what was up!
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Nyela Goodness Reply:
July 15th, 2009 at 12:28 pm
Ok I hear all of this talk about HBCU folk being arrogant, but can we PUHLEASE be real? While you lovely people may not be part of the Consortium of Pompously Arrogant Elitists of PWI and Ivy League Institutions, let’s not pretend that they don’t exist or that you
aren’t onehaven’t met them, too.Oh, and I’m an Ivy Leaguer
so I have enough street cred to make this statement.Reply
Reecie Reply:
July 15th, 2009 at 12:32 pm
preciate that, Nyela. sounds better coming from you! LOL
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RightCoastLexSteele, Pompous Snob Reply:
July 15th, 2009 at 12:39 pm
LOL! I’m not only a member, I’m the president!
Maxwell Mafia in the building!
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Intellectual Hedonist Reply:
July 15th, 2009 at 12:42 pm
I will do you one better,
“I’d be lying if I said I didnt feel a I have a leg up on folks cuz I went to a PWI, and a D1 school at that”, and went to school in the NorthEast, New England at that the birthplace of Higher Ed.
we are all snobs when it comes to our education, because we all (I would hope) value our education. I have read some of the responses to this debate and would like to add from the perspective of an administrator (at a PWI), that things are quite different in both places from the administration of PWI’s v. HBCU’s. In the past 4 years that I have been in my current position I have heard HORROR stories (first hand) from colleagues at HBCU’s about craziness that happens at their institutions then read about it later in the Chronicle of Higher Ed, when a couple of institutions lost their charter, or their president of VP of finance was indicted. Im not saying that crazy ish doesnt happen at PWI’s and I am sure I am not privy to some of the back room deals and other crap that I know that goes on, but I do know from interacting with my colleagues some of which are mentors of mine, that even they know some of the stuff they put up with at their HBCU’s does not go on at PWI’s
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I feel a level of comraderie among fellow HBCU grads, no matter where they went. We all talk smack especially rival schools and whatnot, but its all out of love from me, anyway. I’m sure its the same way among ivies (maybe not. LOL) I live in Florida and felt right at home going on FAMU’s campus when my friend worked there. I have attended various school homecomings in VA, NC, and GA and always felt right at home.
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Peyso was blocked from 3 ways for 2 weeks Reply:
July 15th, 2009 at 11:48 am
U must have never went to a Penn v. Princeton football or basketball game. There is some serious animosity between the 2 schools.
Harvard-Yale football games are the same way too
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Seattle Washington Reply:
July 15th, 2009 at 11:53 am
I wouldn’t necessarily call the Harvard-Yale scrimmage a “football game”. I froze my ass off to see both teams not score for a whole half. They just ran around a lot with a ball in their hands.
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Raqi Reply:
July 15th, 2009 at 1:29 pm
At least you had a football team worth watching. Students at UChicago find out we had one after we got on campus. We respond the same way too… “We have a football team?????” No one goes to the games, and people only went to the basketball games because they did door prize raffles every 5 minutes and served free pizza…
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Reecie Reply:
July 15th, 2009 at 11:54 am
I don’t live or spend a lot of time in the northeast so no….I’m not into football either. don’t hurt me. LOL. I meant comraderie outside of sports though…..
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Smiley Face Reply:
July 15th, 2009 at 12:19 pm
Lol, Reecie if that’s not the truth I don’t know what is! …a homecoming game where Howard got their arses handed to them by Hampton….what! are you serious..all out WAR you hear me? lol!
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I am a proud Spelman Alumna! I love my school and everything that it has helped me to become. At times, did i wonder how things would’ve turned out if i went to a PWI? Of course! But ultimately i am very glad of the decision that I made because my experience has helped shape so many different aspects of my life.
My only issue with the PWI v. HBCU debate is the reaction that I get from other AA’s about my choice in school. I find that i constantly have to defend my decision to go to an HBCU with other “professional” AA’s. It’s really sad. Going to a “top” PWI law school, people are constantly asking “What school did you go to for undergrad?” I find that white people and other minorities are fascinated with my decision and tend to ask me a million and one questions about my institution of choice, which I love. While other AA’s ask me, well you’re smart…why didn’t you apply to (insert any prestigious PWI here). It angers me when they then proceed to inform me that my degree is worthless and won’t take me far….HELLO…are we not at the SAME school now????
But i feel that at the end of the day, you have to do what’s best for you. We can’t all go to the same schools. The diversity in all of our choices for undergrad in itself allows for extreme diversity because all of our experiences are unique, and allows us all to contribute to society in a variety of different ways. It also allows for us all to continue to grow and learn from each other.
My decision to go to Spelman wasn’t a very difficult decision for me to make. My parents were products of an HBCU (Grambling State), and I wanted to be able to experience HBCU life as well. I am getting my PWI experience now, and
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BlueFlame Reply:
July 15th, 2009 at 12:13 pm
sorry…couldn’t finish…boss walked in and i pressed that send button instead of minimize lol…but i am getting my PWI experience now and i feel that this experience is only adding to all of the other experiences that i have had at undergrad…
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Slim Jackson Reply:
July 15th, 2009 at 1:16 pm
LMAO at pressing the send button prematurely cuz the boss walked in. That’s like a dude skeetin off cuz he heard someone walk in the door while he was in the poomps.
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Raqi Reply:
July 15th, 2009 at 1:30 pm
LMAO… oh my….
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“We can’t all go to the same schools. The diversity in all of our choices for undergrad in itself allows for extreme diversity because all of our experiences are unique, and allows us all to contribute to society in a variety of different ways. It also allows for us all to continue to grow and learn from each other.”
Amen! well said.
(I meant for this to be a reply… but apparently the “delete” button hasn’t been invented on 3 ways yet…)
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The biggest negative for HBCUs is disorganized administration (if you went to an HBCU, you know what I’m talking about). Folks sleep on HBCUs all the time – and even then, I’m gonna be real and say all are not created equal. I didn’t go to one because of frats, sororities, or step shows. I didn’t go to one because of the band.
I went to one because at the time, they were pulling more top-notched Black students than Harvard (see FAMU’s track record on pulling more National Achievement Scholars than any other institution in the country circa 1997-1998).
And the alumni network is awesome! I knew my professors and they nurtured my talent into grad school at one of the top universities/programs in my field in this country.
But folks REALLY need to stop acting like there’s a blanket PWI-HBCU comparison. Just like all HBCUs are not created equal, PWIs are NOT the same. And frankly, if and only if you’re coming from an Ivy League-type PWI, will I buy the argument that YOUR PWI education was better than my HBCU education.
I’ve worked at a pretty prestigious PWI teaching undergrads. I see how smart, talented Black kids slip through the cracks every single day. My professors made sure to push every inkling of potential out of me because they recognized a need for more Black scholars in my particular field. I honestly can’t say that that happens so often at PWIs – not when you’re lucky to even have a person of color as a profesor.
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RightCoastLexSteele, Pompous Snob Reply:
July 15th, 2009 at 12:37 pm
“I’ve worked at a pretty prestigious PWI teaching undergrads. I see how smart, talented Black kids slip through the cracks every single day. My professors made sure to push every inkling of potential out of me because they recognized a need for more Black scholars in my particular field. I honestly can’t say that that happens so often at PWIs – not when you’re lucky to even have a person of color as a profesor.”
Very good point. Most professor at large PWI’s don’t give a damn about their students period, much less the ones of color. Hence why TA’s end up teaching classes and you barely see the professor unless you’re lucky enough to track them down during their office hours. I went to a PWHS as well, but lucky for me the classes were small and the few AA teachers that were there made sure they were on my back because apparently I had potential.
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had to say Reply:
July 15th, 2009 at 12:42 pm
“The biggest negative for HBCUs is disorganized administration (if you went to an HBCU, you know what I’m talking about).”
The two Ivy League institutions I went and currently go to are not much better. They dont tell people if they have enough credits to graduate until 2 weeks before graduation ( I know many fallen soliders from Arts and Crafts…) Plus I also have gotten emails from both universities saying they have lost my SS#.
It’s hard to find competent personnel these days
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I feel so incredibly late.
Regardless, I attended an all-white high school (elementary & middle, too) in an all-white suburb in all-white city in an all-white state. That influenced my decision to attend a HBCU because I wanted a new experience as well as my parent being the product of a couple of the same. It was definitely an experience, and one I enjoyed thoroughly. Yes, they did lose my paperwork, and seeing females go to class in 4in stilettos made me roll my eyes. Yet the history, culture, and aura of the school were amazing, and being from grade schools that didn’t even acknowledge MLK day, this was something I definitely needed.
I also attended a private PWI in undergrad and post-grad, and other than the cost of tuition, I really don’t feel either has a significant advantage on the other. Not substantial enough to lord over another anyway. Yes, my PWI had leagues better & more up-to-date facilities and made completion of my thesis much easier than had I used the facilities at my HBCU. Yet if it wasn’t for the feedback & support & different perspectives I received from my advisors at the HBCU, my thesis wouldn’t have traveled the avenue it did.
My PWI made me feel no smarter, and my HBCU made me feel no more Black.
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Sowhatiff Jenkins Reply:
July 15th, 2009 at 1:08 pm
“My PWI made me feel no smarter, and my HBCU made me feel no more Black.”
If there could be closing remarks, these words would be it for me.
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Can I also say this…. the amount of successful graduates that HBCUs have produced is amazing in and of itself, seeing as how HBCUs tend to be at an extreme disadvantage with financial resources. The fact that there is even a basis debate says something, in my opinion. Like I always say, HBCUs make a dollar out of 15 cents and still produce excellence. Imagine if the playing fields were even.
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Intellectual Hedonist Reply:
July 15th, 2009 at 12:54 pm
“the amount of successful graduates that HBCUs have produced is amazing in and of itself,” this is actually relative…
and one has to ask how do you measure success? are you speaking on a local, national, or global scale?
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KT Reply:
July 15th, 2009 at 10:31 pm
either one you wanna pick. success can equal just the amount of black folks who are graduating period. have you seen the stats on how many black folks start college but never graduate?
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This debate is never a fun one for me. But, my heart is telling me to debate the ignorance and let people know the truth.
First I must say, that I am little disgusted with most of the comments because PWI uses the same argument and its a little redundant.
I went to a white school all my life and then went to an HBCU (Hampton) and between these two experiences I feel that Hampton was my best and I am most proud of that accomplishment. I hate my old high school and have only really kept in touch with 3 or 4 people. I have no need or desire to relive my days as the token black girl who was “the funniest black girl they knew” when i was the only damn black girl they knew. You couldn’t have paid me to do that shit for another 4 years. Ten was enough.
Everybody goes to a school that fits them, but, the reason why I went to an HBCU and feel that everyone should is for the experience. I think that blacks that come out of PWIs have animosity towards HBCUs. The conversations I’ve had with people that went to these schools felt like the PWI would give them the better education, instead of really researching each school for what it has to offer.
All I know is that I went to an HBCU and I received an education because my professors WANTED to see a BLACK female get a college degree. I wasn’t a token or representation of the race. I was just me. Also, I don’t understand why PWI grads feel that the white man can educate them better than the black man. By thinking that you are basically saying white people are smarter than you, and their world is real not yours. Isn’t that what the statement…”HBCUs don’t prepare for you for the real world” means? To that I must ask, what the hell is the real world?
Nothing. Not your education, your house, job, car, or family. Every single concept was created by the human imagination which is why nothing is real. Everything is what you make it, and that being said, an HBCU is full of diversity, is a great learning environment, and definitely prepares you for what may come. All you have to do is put your ignorance aside and let the opportunity consume you. To be around other people that look like you and where everyone is striving to learn and grow, just makes you a stronger person and gives you a confidence and pride that PWI grads will NEVER have no matter what they tell you.
But, I guess you can’t explain the unexplainable. You just have to experience it. Sorry for the long rant…that penny is just so loud.
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Peyso was blocked from 3 ways for 2 weeks Reply:
July 15th, 2009 at 12:56 pm
How you gonna tell me about what pride I have and dont have? That’s comical to me…..
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LilBrownSkin Reply:
July 15th, 2009 at 1:04 pm
“…the reason why I went to an HBCU and feel that everyone should is for the experience.”
As we’ve stated earlier, everyone should not go to an HBCU. If every one of us went to either an HBCU or a PWI we would lose out on learning from eachother from our respective experiences.
“Also, I don’t understand why PWI grads feel that the white man can educate them better than the black man. By thinking that you are basically saying white people are smarter than you, and their world is real not yours. Isn’t that what the statement…”HBCUs don’t prepare for you for the real world” means? To that I must ask, what the hell is the real world?”
I can only speak for myself, but I chose to attend a PWI not because I think “the white man” is smarter than me, or that “his” education is better, but because, in my field, “his” name can take me farther. I will take those opportunities, and come and serve my community. Everyone wasn’t mad that President Obama didn’t go to an HBCU, and we want to champion his Ivy League degrees to the public, but now I’m hearing some bitterness towards those of us that chose to go to PWI’s…
And for me, the real world, at least at work, is full of White folk. So yes, working with and adapting to them is high on the priority list.
“To be around other people that look like you and where everyone is striving to learn and grow, just makes you a stronger person and gives you a confidence and pride that PWI grads will NEVER have no matter what they tell you.”
Umm…that too, is a no. Sorry, LOL. The same “confidence and pride” you feel having graduated from an HBCU, can be the same (or better, for me..LOL) pride I feel being one of a FEW Black women (comparatively speaking) to graduate from an Ivy League School. To say “no matter what they tell you” is saying a bit much, on your part. I can’t tell you how you feel, and you can’t tell me how I feel.
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Nyela Goodness Reply:
July 15th, 2009 at 1:09 pm
Dag…I was drafting a response with similar sentiments and refreshed just to see if someone beat me to the punch. Well, no need for me to be redundant…
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Sowhatiff Jenkins Reply:
July 15th, 2009 at 1:29 pm
Co em effin sign.
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Sowhatiff Jenkins Reply:
July 15th, 2009 at 12:58 pm
“To that I must ask, what the hell is the real world?Nothing. Not your education, your house, job, car, or family. Every single concept was created by the human imagination which is why nothing is real. Everything is what you make it…”
Great point. Which just means that either way, we’re all gonna be prepared right? Pride in one doesn’t mean tear down the other.
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RightCoastLexSteele, Pompous Snob Reply:
July 15th, 2009 at 2:25 pm
“I think that blacks that come out of PWIs have animosity towards HBCUs. The conversations I’ve had with people that went to these schools felt like the PWI would give them the better education, instead of really researching each school for what it has to offer.”
Ok. Here’s the thing. I have no animosity towards HBCU grads at all. My problem is a lot of the people I know that went to HBCU come from The Black Bougie side of life. All the people of this ilk I know usually have a tendency to turn their nose down at other folks and think they are more black than you because their folks were in the civil rights movement or they were the first black this that and the third. Or they tend to be super militant on this go back to Africa/African diaspora bullsh*t, which is completely ludicris to me. That’s cool, be all the black you can be. But if you’ve never been in a civil rights struggle and you’ve never left the contiguous 48 much less been to Africa, how you gon tell my fresh off the boat ass that you are more black than me because yo daddy met MLK. FOH! And they somehow feel that their negro school degree validates their blackness….yet they won’t set foot in the hood where they grew up once they get money or have never set foot in the hood because they grew up w/ money. Please.
“All I know is that I went to an HBCU and I received an education because my professors WANTED to see a BLACK female get a college degree. I wasn’t a token or representation of the race.”
Now, how is being a black female set up to succeed at a black school any less token than being a black female set up to succeed at a PWI? Riddle me that…
HBCUs don’t prepare for you for the real world” means? To that I must ask, what the hell is the real world?
The real world is that place where unless you work at a BET, VIBE or a parole office, everyone you work with comes from very different places…like India…or Sweden…or Canada, Alaska, Ghana, Trinidad, and Ecuador. I’m glad you HBCU’ers got to meet different black folks w/ different recipes for Fried Chicken and Greens, but the world is more diverse than a damn soul food recipe. On the one hand you wanna bitch and moan about racism but in the very next breathe you are just as prejudicial in your thinking as our oppressors. The world is no longer black and white, sorry to tell you.
“Also, I don’t understand why PWI grads feel that the white man can educate them better than the black man.”
It’s not that…it’s just that…Idk….the computers in the white man’s computer labs work. The white man’s admin employees show up and handle their biz so I can pick up my transcript. Not just talking out my ass here dear, I’ve spoken to heads from HBCU’s and their bookstore didnt have the book they needed for class. Like really?
I’m all for learning and striving around other black folk, but my ego also enjoys showing Indians, Latins, Canadians, Africans and everyone else that cares to look that yes, this likkle black bway from the island can perform when them lights are on.
And besdies…
Maxwell Mafia- “We Run Gov’t”
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CHeeKZ Money Reply:
July 15th, 2009 at 3:35 pm
2 days in a row you have killed the board. You my friend have a gift.
CO-SIGN
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RightCoastLexSteele, Pompous Snob Reply:
July 15th, 2009 at 3:45 pm
Thank you. I cultivated it at a PWI.
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Ms. Cherry Reply:
July 15th, 2009 at 3:03 pm
“…you are basically saying white people are smarter than you, and their world is real not yours. Isn’t that what the statement…”HBCUs don’t prepare for you for the real world” means? To that I must ask, what the hell is the real world?”
No, what it means is that when your white co-worker says something like “Malcolm X was a terrorist”, it won’t be the first time you’ve heard that and you’ll know how to handle yourself w/o losing your job or having it ruin you day.
It means that you’ll understand that just as much important business happens after work at happy hour as does during office hours and when all the white folk head to McFinigan’s for some Bud Light you’ll be in the mix, singing along to “Sweet Caroline” and be able karaoke your way into that promotion you wanted.
It means that you maybe went to a random indian party or movie screening and actually have something to talk about with Kutrhapali the IT dude when he stops by. Everybody wants to know why you got a new PC and only you know why.
It means when Berstein’s wife gives birth you know to say mozeltoff and ask when the bris is.
I could go on all day…
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RightCoastLexSteele, Pompous Snob Reply:
July 15th, 2009 at 3:10 pm
OH OH OH! GOOD TIMES NEVER SEEM SOOOOO GOOD!
Probably not the correct lyrics, but this is what it sounds like when I’m drunk.
Also means you can whip ass in flip cup, beer bong and do a 32 sec. keg stand (that’s a long standing record btw)
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Peyso was blocked from 3 ways for 2 weeks Reply:
July 15th, 2009 at 3:16 pm
I would dominate that 32 sec but it has to be Natty Light
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LilBrownSkin Reply:
July 15th, 2009 at 4:03 pm
OMG PREACH!
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RightCoastLexSteele, Pompous Snob Reply:
July 15th, 2009 at 4:29 pm
Bruh, I’m sure we will cross paths…we can get a kegger and settle this!
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1. Thanks for all the comments; to the regulars and to those we haven’t seen in a minute! Keep em coming. pause.
2. The argument is always the same on both sides, so calling either one redundant is well…just that. The points raised are never novel on either side. People have their passions either way. However, I must say, those who attended PWIs are always made to feel “ignorant” or close minded by those who went to HBCUs…just an observation.
3. We all made are choices for the same, or varied reasons. Let’s not call either choice or view ignorant. God forbid someone who attended a PWI called the reasoning for attending or prefering HBCU’s ignorant and our black cards would get pulled.
4. Vote for Three ways!!
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Smiley Face Reply:
July 15th, 2009 at 1:06 pm
Scccrrr..the record just skipped for me with this statement. Flip the scrip for a moment…
“However, I must say, those who attended PWIs are always made to feel “ignorant” or close minded by those who went to HBCUs…just an observation.”
Conversely, the same can be said about students who attended a HBCU being made to feel ‘ignorant’ for choosing to attend one.
It’s not a tit for tat thing but if I hear another ‘you’ll never get that far with a degree from Hampton’ or ‘you’re so smart why did you choose a HBCU’ so help me baby Jesus…
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Peyso was blocked from 3 ways for 2 weeks Reply:
July 15th, 2009 at 1:11 pm
“You’re so smart why did you choose a HBCU’” – Can you explain to me why do you take offense to this statement? I really dont understand.
I would argue that normally most people go to the best school that they can get into. If they dont there is usually a good reason (financial, too far, wasnt a good fit, didnt have my major, etc.). We all know that HBCUs aint top 25, so I think its a legititmate question. Am I mistaken?
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Smiley Face Reply:
July 15th, 2009 at 2:20 pm
Peyso…when you give me the ‘gas face, like blechk , like why on earth oh my god noooooo face’ when asking the question yeah I get a tad bit ‘touchous’; the eyebrow arch, the change in tone from once thinking smart, college educated woman to oh she JUST went to a HBCU and “you’re too smart to go to a HBCU…” (whatever that means). You’re not better than me because I choose to go to a HBCU. When I get comments like that it makes it seems like attending Hampton was a last resort because that’s the best I could do…that’s why I get ‘touchous’.
It’s even worse when its the folks I knew who went to a PWI that wasn’t on anyone’s top 25 list of anything but I don’t react the same way as they do me. They get a nod and asked about their experience, not pitied.
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Sowhatiff Jenkins Reply:
July 15th, 2009 at 1:14 pm
I feel you. And if my black card continues to get challenged for not wanting to attend an HBCU, I too will have summon the help of the Lord.
At the end of the day, how other people perceive our choices doesn’t mean jack. There are plenty of bum ass PWI grads and the same can be said for some grads of HBCUs. its been said today, but who you know makes a huge difference, whether you attend a PWI or HBCU.
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Smiley Face Reply:
July 15th, 2009 at 2:21 pm
Amen! LOL
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LoudPen Reply:
July 18th, 2009 at 7:32 pm
Thank you for making those comments. You were right, I must admit that I was one of the commenters that took offense to things and got overly emotional and carried away. I’m just proud of my school and education.
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I think that all the people who went to a HBCU would argue for PWIs had they went there and all the people who went to PWIs would argue for HBCU’s had they went there. I think many times people make decisions just because and then apply some type of rationale to them. It appears that in many of the comments (not all but more than zero) this was the case.
Do I think that I have a leg up b/c I went to a PWI? Yes I do. If I went to Shitty McSh!tville State A&M Tech Community A&T University of Indiana in Pennsylvania, I still would some how feel that I have a leg up. I’ve seen this convo and convos like this play out in many different arenas and not only between HBCUs and PWIs. I’ve seen HU vs “the real” HU, Lincoln vs Cheney, FAM vs BCC, Penn vs Princeton, Harvard vs Yale, Mich vs Ohio State, Duke vs. UNC, AKA vs DST. People are going to look for a way to be better than you. That’s just how life is. Regardless of where you went to school, there are some things that will always be the same. Every school will have some dickheads and some whores and some jocks and some good professors and some people who get pregnant and drop out and some people who get pregnant and finish and some people who pledge and dont graduate and people who wanna pledge but dont get picked etc. yadda yadda yadda.
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LoudPen said: Everybody goes to a school that fits them, but, the reason why I went to an HBCU and feel that everyone should is for the experience. I think that blacks that come out of PWIs have animosity towards HBCUs. The conversations I’ve had with people that went to these schools felt like the PWI would give them the better education, instead of really researching each school for what it has to offer.
I agree with most of this (statement I quoted)… really all of it.. but it should be added that if you substituted “HBCU” for “PWI” in this, it’d be me talking.
It’s ALL ABOUT THE INDIVIDUAL… PWIness worked for me and I have a lot of successful friends who went to an HBCU and I know they wouldn’t be where they are if they hadn’t and I have friends who went to PWIs who might be where I am if they hadn’t. This is why I agree with what you said; however I think it’s so important for all of us to understand the extreme individuality of schooling and, like you said, get educated. Know your options and know what you need and then go find it. It might be at a PWI it might be at an HBCU but go find it…
I think there are 2 things at play when we start talking about animosity. One is how many black people who attended PWIs who have experienced that animosity from individuals at HBCUs and vice versa. The second is that some people then want to pre-empt said animosity with their own. I used to have to watch myself being unfairly defensive with people who attended HBCUs because they haven’t been defensive with me.
Nowadays… if I can’t simply say “it worked for me and I’m happy with my decision” and that be that, then we don’t need to talk about it.
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I don’t even know where to go with this. I just came back from a meeting and I find 120+ comments. Shout out to all the people contributing. However, I think folks are getting a lil too Emo on this. Emo in a different sort of way. Not the b*tch negro way. Folks are getting on the defensive. I can tell cuz the word “ignorant” is being thrown around a lot. Nobody likes to be called ignorant, so let’s find a new word for the rest of the day. Okay? Thanks.lol.
Slim “The Master of Debates” Jackson
yep, exactly what you thinkin.
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Single Black Male Reply:
July 15th, 2009 at 1:48 pm
F8ck all these peace sh*t. PWIs 4 Life!
*throws a chair*
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Peyso was blocked from 3 ways for 2 weeks Reply:
July 15th, 2009 at 1:54 pm
I bet you throwin a chair gonna start a riot at a PWI and at a HBCU
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Single Black Male Reply:
July 15th, 2009 at 1:57 pm
Naw … PWIs only riot when their team either wins or loses a big game. At least that’s how it was at mine. We made national news … several times … several years in a row.
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Slim Jackson Reply:
July 15th, 2009 at 2:00 pm
LMAO
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CHeeKZ Money Reply:
July 15th, 2009 at 3:44 pm
O god. I can’t breathe. That was too funny. I’m crying. I think I am going to get fired.
The perfect long running Boondocks joke.
How did u manage to get such good timing on the internet. All I can see is gangstalicious throwing the chair!
*Dead*
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Smiley Face Reply:
July 15th, 2009 at 2:27 pm
you started it Slim *sticking out my tongue like a lil girl*
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Slim Jackson Reply:
July 15th, 2009 at 2:33 pm
Careful now. Can’t be stickin your tongue out in a room full of rowdy men and judgmental women.lol. I keed. I keed.
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My two biggest issues on this topic are:
1) UNCF wouldn’t give me any money unless I went to an HBCU. I think that’s discrimination of interests.
2) When I applied for colleges, I carefully looked over requirements for enrollment for each school. I had a problem with the GPA requirements. I only needed a 2.5 to get into the HBCU of my choice; I needed a 3.3 to get into the PWI of my choice. I just didn’t want to go to school where they were going to let me in even if I was a serial killer…just because I had a 2.6.
In all seriousness, as a naive junior in high school, I judged the caliber of an institution’s education by its enrollment requirements. HBCUs were knocking down my door, but I rarely ran away from a challenge. I applied to an Ivy. I got in. I graduated (NOT with a 3.3, lol). That’s all I have to say.
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RightCoastLexSteele, Pompous Snob Reply:
July 15th, 2009 at 2:27 pm
“I only needed a 2.5 to get into the HBCU of my choice; I needed a 3.3 to get into the PWI of my choice. I just didn’t want to go to school where they were going to let me in even if I was a serial killer…just because I had a 2.6.”
^^^^^EH HEM!^^^
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MaPockets Reply:
July 15th, 2009 at 2:29 pm
yeah…that was an awful joke. But I hope you get the point.
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Sowhatiff Jenkins Reply:
July 15th, 2009 at 2:31 pm
“1) UNCF wouldn’t give me any money unless I went to an HBCU. I think that’s discrimination of interests.”
I am STILL pissed about that. Sends all kinds of wrong messages.
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Single Black Male Reply:
July 15th, 2009 at 3:26 pm
One HBCU sent me a full scholarship letter before I even applied. Then they sent me the “application” … there were no essays or letters of recommendation needed, just your social and a $15 application fee which they waived for me.
You have my 100% co-sign here.
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N.I.A. naturally.... Reply:
July 15th, 2009 at 4:23 pm
i definitely didn’t have that experience. but then again, Spelman is the only HBCU I applied to, and I definitely needed more than a 2.6. just like there are bad PWIs, there are bad HBCUs…PWI party schools, HBCU party schools. etc., etc.
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Growing up in PG County, MD, one of the most affluent
and yet and still so hoodBlack communities in the country, when it came time for college, the thing to do was to go to either UMES, Morgan, Howard, Bowie or PG Community College (aka Largo University).Call me bougie if you want to but I hated my Black high school experience. I saw people get beat bloody and have their new Jordan’s stripped from their feet and sold for $5 in the hallway; someone shot at my bus; we had HUGE amazonian flying roaches; teacher smashing off students; administrators catering to problem students to look “cool”; a corrupt
Nupeprincipal who choked out a girl in front of about 300 students and kept his job…My high school was hellish and hoody and I wanted out. I was okay with seeing 2000 less Black people for 4 years.
I gave my friends who wanted to go to Howard some slack, they have a great Medical school and Law program, but I didn’t understand WHY anyone would want to go to UMES or Morgan, let alone BOWIE!?!?! WHY?
To me college was about opportunity and getting a job one day, not just partying. Yes, I wanted to party (and I did) but I wasn’t applying to a program that wasn’t ranked.
Most of my friends who went to HBCUs in the DMV ended up stereotypes. People had babies and dropped out, never graduated and gave up after 6yrs, said “f” their major and just got a good gov’t job working in their momma or daddy’s office…
I’m not saying you can’t be successful going to a HBCU, but in my experience, most of the people I went to high school with who were going to HBCUs were doing it for terrible reasons and those weren’t the people I wanted to go to college with
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MaPockets Reply:
July 15th, 2009 at 2:34 pm
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Raqi Reply:
July 15th, 2009 at 2:47 pm
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Smiley Face Reply:
July 15th, 2009 at 2:53 pm
I’m sorry that was your experience..mine was the complete opposite. I grew up in MoCo (Montgomery County) so I don’t know if that colored my experience differently from yours.
I had a principal and guidance counselor (both graduates of HBCU’s; Spelman & Hampton) who cared. Implemented programs to get students free computers, had workshops on earning scholarships and got a lot of my friends involved in Links. Having influences like that…I definitely didn’t want to go to 13th grade which was, at the time, any and all schools in the DMV (metro) regardless.
Some people disagree with being a product of your environment but I can say that I was influenced by mine.
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Ms. Cherry Reply:
July 15th, 2009 at 3:12 pm
Yeah it’s nice when your politicians don’t steal money from the school system…. LUCKKKYYYY!!!
I was in the IB program at PG County school. Such an oxymoron. My program was great but the school was horrible. I was also a product of my environment to the extent that my IB teachers encouraged me to want more for myself than the lame opportunities that were pushed at me find the needles in the haystack.
My school guidance office was a joke. They weren’t allowed to touch my college application. When I went to get a copy of my transcript, no bull, it was in the bottom of my counselor’s drawer in a rolled up stack w/ a rubber band on it.
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Tunde Reply:
July 15th, 2009 at 4:10 pm
what high school did you attend? i’m from pg county and i went to a pretty hood high school [fairmont heights high school] (that also had a stellar biotechnology program). i also chose to attend UMES [Go Hawks!] (even though i was accepted to a couple of top tier PWIs). i still haven’t regretted my decision once. btw, have you ever been to UMES, Morgan or Bowie (well you’ve probably been to Bowie)? what college did you attend? that’s what I want to know. yeah i’m getting a little personal. but when someone slights my alma mater (imo with out good reason) that’s going to happen. *shrugs*
also, you might need to find new friends. most of my friends attended HBCUs and they are doing quite well in their respective fields or are attaining advanced degrees.
if you are cool with your choice to attend whatever school you attended then fine but don’t generalize HBCUs from your area. o_O
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Ms. Cherry Reply:
July 15th, 2009 at 4:36 pm
I went to Central. Sad that our school system has some stellar programs but the schools themselves are a mess.
Sorry to dog out UMES, I’m sure like with most anything, it is what you make it, but I knew a lot of people who got caught up in the social scene out there (which was mostly why they chose to go to UMES in the first place) and it just sounded like foolishness and drama (hence the 13th grade). I’ve never made it out to Eastern Shore. I was invited several times but wasn’t looking forward to the high school reunion.
I know some very successful people who went to UMES, Morgan and Howard, even PGCC, but I hear more bad things than good.
I will clarify that my opinion of DMV HBCUs has more to do with the student body than the academic programs.
UMES is at least a part of the UM system so administratively from what I understand they have less foolywang going on than Morgan or Howard. I was not impressed when I visited friends at either school and I was outraged at the issues my friends had when applying. That whole getting your finaid package months late or being told to find your own housing thing… not feeling it.
I like being able to put on an angry black girl face and intimidate my way into getting the white girl at finaid to remove the hold so I can register for classes.
With my friends… I have friends who are holding it down and friends who are a hot mess. I find Morehouse men to be some of the most obnoxious people on earth, but my boy went to Morehouse and is the MAN. He owns his own business, has his own foundation and more masters degrees than Kobe has rings.
As for my alma mater… I bleed Orange!
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Single Black Male Reply:
July 15th, 2009 at 4:53 pm
Wow … I have to jump in on this one.
As a Eleanor Roosevelt Graduate (Go Raiders) and going to the College one town over (you know which one … the PWI) I relate to Cherry.
HS just wasn’t that great. I had grown up around black folks for years and was very in touch with my inner n****a. Going to a school where I was suddenly a real minority and actually having to deal with 2520s was a good one.
And not to hop on the “Lets go on MD HBCUs”, but I’ve heard my share of horror stories too. Tunde, glad you loved UMES, but I’ve met too many who went and just got caught up … and ended up at PGCC after a semester.
Damn … how many PG School grads we got on here?
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Ms. Cherry Reply:
July 15th, 2009 at 5:01 pm
HS just wasn’t that great. I had grown up around black folks for years and was very in touch with my inner n****a.
My college roommate was amazed at how I could sense a fight brewing anywhere between 30-60secs before it actually popped off. Any self-respecting PGCPS graduate could do the same.
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Tunde Reply:
July 15th, 2009 at 5:01 pm
sbm,
i’m sorry but roosevelt is hardly a black school. its probably the most diverse in pg county. i have 4 cousins that graduated from there and y’all have a gang of 2520’s as well as asians.
i don’t know how many pgc grads are on here. lol
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Smiley Face Reply:
July 15th, 2009 at 5:43 pm
My nephew went to Roosevelt…he’s…a little off…I love him but he’s weird.
..can I at least get an honorable mention for living/graduating in Montgomery County?
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Single Black Male Reply:
July 15th, 2009 at 9:06 pm
You don’t get any points for Montgomery County … you actually lost you a lot.
And don’t hate on Roosevelt … don’t be mad because we were the only HS that wasn’t super slumming. We won so many Blue Ribbons they had to create a new award … and then we started winning those.
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damn, i feel later than Reina.
–i went to diverse Catholic grade schools, but my private high school all vanilla with chocolate sprinkles — 90% Dutch Reformed Republican Christians. it was a culture shock, but i have good memories nonetheless. most of the students went to the 3 main feeder colleges in Michigan or Iowa, which lacked diversity as well. it was rare to hear someone saying they weren’t going to those schools. reflecting back, my counselors never once mentioned other schools for me to apply to other than those three and Purdue. luckily, i live in chicago so i knew there were other schools out there, but still, attending an HBCU never really crossed my mind. i’m pretty sure the reason i didn’t go to a HBCU was because of the lack of knowledge not only from myself, but primarily from my high school. the lack of diversity in that school led to lack of diversity in the college choices.
–the PWI i attend is also ranked somewhere as a top diverse university / college town/ something to that effect, but one thing i’ve noticed is that when you start taking those 300 & 400 level classes, that diversity ain’t showin’ lol.
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Is this the highest commented post on 3 ways to date? wow!
UNCF only gives money to private HBCUs. I def didn’t benefit going to a public school. I’m still amazed that black HBCU grads look down on and call PWI grads “ignorant”! that totally blows my mind seeing as PWIs are known as majority schools for a reason! I’ve always felt like HBCU graduates are the underdogs. but LexSteele said this comes from the black “elite”, so I guess that makes sense. I am not of the ilk at all….I have a lot of friends from PWIs and they have never expressed that to me either. Maybe because we all come from similar middle class backgrounds. I definitely learned something today…. I know because I did attend a HBCU I WANTED to go to a PWI for graduate school. I learned a lot there too, but I’m glad for the socialization and family atmosphere I experienced in undergrad….I am still close to faculty and professors til this day (some are my fb friends, LOL). I have a hard time keeping up with my grad school profs….
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I really don’t care much for this debate b/c I’ve witnessed ppl from HBCUs & PWIs or from no schooling at all achieve leaps & bounds. My degree from a prestigious PWI carries a hell of a lot of weight, BUT sometimes even that isn’t enough. Sometimes it’s about how savvy a person is about a particular industry or simply about knowing the right ppl…
But for the sake of debate, I’ll just speak on my own experiences for a moment:
I didn’t apply to an HBCU b/c my momma wouldn’t let me. She visited Morehouse & Spelman & was pretty much turned off by the extreme lack of upkeep – holes in windows, muddy lawns, caution tape thrown up all over the place… Such small campuses shouldn’t be that hard to keep up. Among other concerns, she definitely questioned the quality of these schools as a whole based on their appearance. When I visited these campuses years later with her while passing thru ATL they were much better, but I still saw what she meant – why would she send her children to a school where she couldn’t visibly see a reflection of quality investments being made towards ensuring enriching educational experiences? Whatever the reality & true value of these institutions are, many ppl, including other black folk, sometimes can’t see it.
I also have several friends who attended HBCUs for undergrad, & continued into grad school programs at the likes of Harvard. I have friends who attended PWIs for undergrad & continued into grad school at HBCUs, who subsequently complained about the administrations & financial aid. I also have friends who have come out of their HBCUs absolutely despising white ppl, wanting nothing to do w/ them – friends who before attending their respective schools could have cared less.
On behalf of PWIs, mine had a fabulously close-knit black community, complete w/ African diasporic experiences & the whole divine 9. I also had my fair share of dealing w/ racial issues & I was able to learn & grow a lot from those challenges as a result.
Like everyone else, I really wouldn’t exchange my experience for any other. But now, in the after, it’s me, & not my degree, that is going to get me to where I ultimately want to be.
So all in all, I think that I’d let my future kids decide for themselves what type of school they’ll attend, but I think I’d prefer them striving for the best (which I guess are, at the moment & foreseeable future, PWIs).
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I currently go to a PWI and I can remember that when I was applying to colleges I never realistically considered an HBCU. I came from a High School and that had an overwhelming number of black and hispanic students and I knew i wanted something different. Plus I heard about the “fashion show” rumors and I felt like if I wanted chance at bagging someone, I couldn’t compete with that lol. After I’ve gone to a PWI I can truly say that it only looks diverse from far away. True diversity is not really about someone skin color. In my opinion it’s more about someone’s socio-economic background. Black and white people all act the same in my eyes. I kinda wish I had went to an HBCU where I would’ve felt more comfortable and I feel like I could’ve still learned how to do my networking thing for the corporate world.
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What’s the point of all the back and forth? No one is going to say “You know what, I’m wrong, I should have went to a PWI”. Do people really learn life lessons and apply them to their daily lives? I think we should all just talk about something else at this point.
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Slim Jackson Reply:
July 15th, 2009 at 4:41 pm
I think we should keep going onward to 200 comments.lol
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Single Black Male Reply:
July 15th, 2009 at 5:06 pm
Stop begging … its unbecoming
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Ms. Cherry Reply:
July 15th, 2009 at 4:41 pm
I agree… new topic: Northeastern PWIs are better than all other PWI… no!? lol!
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Peyso was blocked from 3 ways for 2 weeks Reply:
July 15th, 2009 at 4:42 pm
does philly count as the Northeast?
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Seattle Washington Reply:
July 15th, 2009 at 4:43 pm
Judges…
Yes, Philly counts as Northeast.
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ASmith Reply:
July 15th, 2009 at 4:44 pm
Oh hayell no.
Southern PWI’s are the best… a good football game watching the drunk, dressed up 2520s beats ANYTHANG ya’ll got.
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Joey Reply:
July 15th, 2009 at 4:56 pm
Ummmm some Northeastern PWI’s have all that you speak of… like PENN STATE (NITTANY LIONS HOLLERRRRR). Northeast cold @$$ can’t get too wild cuz it’s too cold so may as well do some homework. Best football games and tailgating PERIOD. White ppl painted in blue and white and dressed up like JoePa and white girls naked with their mouths open… What more could you want?? So that settles it. It’s not about HBCU or PWI. It’s PSU and nothing else compares.
Is that 200 yet??
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Seattle Washington Reply:
July 15th, 2009 at 4:58 pm
Congrats Joey!!! You’re our 200th commenter. What do we have for her Slim?!
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ASmith Reply:
July 15th, 2009 at 4:58 pm
You say some…
All of ours do…
There is NO WAY a non-Southern school has better football or tailgating. That’s just not humanly possible. SEC all day, and you can put that in your pipe and smoke it.
And if that wasn’t 200, maybe this one is.
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Ms. Cherry Reply:
July 15th, 2009 at 5:06 pm
Northeast cold @$$ can’t get too wild cuz it’s too cold so may as well do some homework.
Nah B… if you get cold, you’re not drunk enough… you’d be amazed how long you can stay outside after about 10 drinks. I’ve have some amazing times and wondrous journeys in sub degree weather
Also I’m sure some of the cold weather PWI greeks can give some pointers on other ways to withstand the cold. (play nice boys!)
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ASmith Reply:
July 15th, 2009 at 4:43 pm
I was just headed over here to ask a similar question.
I’m all about sharing experiences (which I think was the point) but no one is going to say “you’re right, I shoulda took my black self to an HBCU/PWI… I effed up and I’m gonna pay dearly for it…”
I am, however, enjoying the bits scattered about the experiences people had at HBCUs (RightCoastLexSteele is basically describing the very experience I had so that’s just reminiscing which I do urrday, anyway…)
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Seattle Washington Reply:
July 15th, 2009 at 4:56 pm
I went to speak at Howard and found myself in awe because it is my frat’s Alpha Chapter & because I was at the quote/unquote mecca of HBCUs. I also was inspired and excited to talk to a classroom full of colored faces. Especially since my industry is quite the opposite. However, I will say that the facilities were something to be desired. The professor who hosted me called out my surprised look at the classrooms and the resources available to the students. It depressed me that such a renown institution struggles in such basic areas.
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Joey Reply:
July 16th, 2009 at 8:28 am
I know what you can give me for being #200, boo… wink… wink… LOL.
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Slim Jackson Reply:
July 16th, 2009 at 8:59 am
Ya know, I tried to reply to this yesterday…and there was no reply button.lol. You get the grand prize…the very grand prize.
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I’m sorry mr. slim jackson, but as a dual degreed HBCU graduate, I do not believe you have been afforded THAT many more opportunities than any other educated African-American. There is NOT a single thing that I wish I had an opportunity to explore. What I have discovered is that as an African-American, your success is not measured by the institution that hands you the degree, but by what drives you to pursue your dreams. Then again, it depends on what you are basing success off of…an ivy degree?
Even still, there are people out there accomplishing what you or I may never accomplish and do not hold a degree from either a PWI or HBCU. Graduates from HBCUs aspire to accomplish goals no less than a PWI graduate and by no means are we held back from accomplishing them. I am currently a resident at a PWI and I am in no way having issues with adjusting to my “new” environment.
If anything I have found that HBCU graduates emerge from their institutions with a lot more confidence and self-awareness than which they entered. Fighting racism and knowing that they think I’ve been granted acceptance into their institution based on affirmative action was not how I wanted to go about life. I actually feel bad for any African-American that has never been afforded that HBCU experience.
I am actually curious as to what you do for a living considering as how you attended Cornell. (just curious)
And for the record….women from HBCUs are not easy p*ssy (@single black man) and it is unfortunate that people honestly believe that.
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Slim Jackson Reply:
July 15th, 2009 at 5:06 pm
I’m the CEO of a software development company, yet I’m still in my 20s. I would never have been able to do this without Cornell. Hooray for me. I gets money and my degree keeps me satisfied a la Kanye West skit on the College Dropout album.
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ana_nicole Reply:
July 15th, 2009 at 5:07 pm
basically….your institution has no baring on your accomplishments and success. so the shock and awe of the new surgeon generals educational status should not come as a surprise.
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Sowhatiff Jenkins Reply:
July 15th, 2009 at 5:24 pm
“Fighting racism and knowing that they think I’ve been granted acceptance into their institution based on affirmative action was not how I wanted to go about life. I actually feel bad for any African-American that has never been afforded that HBCU experience.”
::takes the gloves off::
I’m sorry, but what the hell does this even mean? The “racism” to which you refer isn’t limited to the halls of my PWI. One could argue that since we have fought it before, as you assume, those who attend PWIs will be more prepared to handle. Note I said, one could argue. Not I think.
I could care less about how people think I got into a school. I graduated, got the degree and t-shirt to go with it. And please don’t pity us po black folk who haven’t “been afforded that HBCU experience”. We’s still fine.
Your comment is particularly offensive and closeminded. Take your misinformed pity and unfounded sense of whatever drove you to look down on those who attended PWIs elsewhere.
But thanks for sharing nonetheless.
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CHeekZ Obama Reply:
July 16th, 2009 at 1:26 am
oooooooo the Hempstead came out in Tiff on that one.
I have noticed the pro HSBCU kids are really avoiding the conversation about resources.
I have a cuz that went to a decent public school..decent. He worked his butt off, did some amazing internships and wanted the best jobs coming out of College on Wall Street, on the floor (from what I heard analyst is a better job, but not the point of the story).
He applies to Lehman Brothers and they tell him he can’t get on the floor, maybe he should try to do something else. He pushed, they say no. He pushes, they say no. Finally he asks why, they say those position are for Ivy League Grads (I don’t know if she said Ivy or Top 25 but when he told me the story he said Ivy). However, they had a slow year recruiting and he got the ‘dream’ job anyway.
Of course being my cousin, He completely out performs all the Ivy kids on the job (even survives the company going belly up), proving the HSBCU point that the degree doesn’t mean spit. But he learned his lesson, this Sept he will be going to Wharton, b/c he doesn’t want to have to only get in by the skin of his teeth.
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N.I.A. naturally.... Reply:
July 16th, 2009 at 11:09 am
not avoiding…there is a big difference in the resources b/c there is a big difference in the money. that’s just the truth. i have no argument against that. except, small PWIs have less resources than larger PWIs generally, and the same goes for HBCUs generally.
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Leo Reply:
October 21st, 2009 at 5:37 pm
well said…its interesting how HBCU kids fight so hard on that issue- when 2 cousins of mine transfered from their HBCUs because they felt more racism on their HBCU grounds then they do at their PWI. One is real light and the other dark…just real funny
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ok, i’m going to attempt to have the last word on this thing.
i was blessed to have both the PWI and HBCU experience. I graduated from Spelman and attended Stanford during my junior year. from everything i’ve read on this site, i can attest that there is no difference in the real world experience PWI vs. HBCU…i think black students(and non-black students) from both campuses either can leave college very naive about other cultures, or they can leave ready to take over the world. I think that really depend on the person, and how they embrace the diverse opportunities presented to them.
Students from both campuses can make incredible contacts that can help them achieve their future goals…or at least point them in the right direction. I met people at Stanford that I keep in contact with that aren’t black, and they have been a real inspiration to me in the furtherance of my goals. but from Spelman, I have that “sisterly hook-up” of knowing that there are other Spelman alums that will look out for you, and let you know of all kinds of opportunities available to you. And with all of the SpelHouse connections in corporate america and academia, networking was an everyday occurance for many of us.
As for education, I took classes by the best professors at both Spelman and Stanford…experts in the field of psychology, economics, political science, sociology, and history at both campuses. And these professors set high standards for all of their students. The main difference b/t the campuses is that I still talk to my Spelman professors, and have been out to happy hour with them. They know my name, remember papers I wrote, and generally have taken an interest in my achievements in undergrad and post grad.
The biggest difference i got out of going to Stanford was the parties. There was always somewhere to go to drink, and the white frats were always having parties, and
making outdrinking with white boys was all new to me. I partied at Stanford more than I ever dreamed partying at Spelman. Not b/c there weren’t any opportunities, but b/c I felt more free to act a fool…when in Rome. But, it lacked the familial feel, and really, i felt that if I didn’t hang out with the Black at Stanford crowd, then I was shunned, as was any black student who had white friends, and partied with white girls, and went hard at the white frat parties.but for me, attending Stanford was about experiencing something new, not just hanging out with the same kind of people who went to Spelman and Morehouse. And I got that experience. So, I don’t knock people who chose to attend and PWI for a more culturally diverse atmosphere, if they actualy took part of that diversity instead of segregating themselve on one side of campus.
so, I guess my point is, to those who attended a PWI, don’t assume so many negatives about HBCUs. we are recruited by the best grad and professional schools, and the best companies in America…just like some of you. we have the same networking and real world opportunities (at least some of us do)…they really aren’t as bad as you’ve been led to believe. And to my fellow HBCU grads, it’s cool to be proud of your insitution, but don’t put down the PWI black folk…they had to do what they had to do for them, the same way we had to do what was best for us.
Ok, i’m done know….who’s going to see Harry Potter tonight? I saw it at midnight.
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N.I.A. naturally.... Reply:
July 15th, 2009 at 5:55 pm
sorry so long. i just had to get that out there….
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CHeeKZ Money Reply:
July 16th, 2009 at 9:31 am
Sorry.Can’t.Let.You.Get.The.Last.Word.
If you studied Political Science while you were at Stanford, depending on when you were there, you got to learn under Condoleezza Rice, a future Sec of State! Sec of State! You can’t say that is equal to any other professor. You washed away that value and didn’t even mention that in your evaluation of your time at Stanford. And that is just the field I know about…
Granted she probably didn’t care about you or your performance (heck she doesn’t care much about her own performance) but lets be fair and balance (like Fox News…. that was a joke).
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N.I.A. naturally.... Reply:
July 16th, 2009 at 11:11 am
i just missed Condi. I was there 2002-2003 academic year. but you can say that about PoliSci people at other universities who didn’t get the chance to study under Condi.
But I have to disagree about her not caring…I think Condi cares more than she lets on….
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CHeeKZ Money Reply:
July 16th, 2009 at 1:05 pm
look at you. Fighting for that last word. Damn girl. You like being on top don’t you? Sexy little southern thing (i think u r from the south, I forget where people are from).
Condi? Look I know she gets bad wrap for working with Pubic Hair Adminstration. However, she still applied their smug attitude to handling the press and informing the population. And she was still Sec of State during all those unsuccessful unilateral campaigns.
But seriously… Harry Potter… worth the wait?
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N.I.A. naturally.... Reply:
July 16th, 2009 at 7:32 pm
I agree with you. Condi was a high ranking member of the Bush-Cheney mafia family, and she has to answer for all of that.
Harry Potter…I did not like it. Didn’t follow the book, which wasn’t that big a deal since none of the movies followed. But of all the movies, this one was the worse.
And yes, this southern belle likes being on top….
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I went to a PWI here in WASHINGTON DC and am very proud that I did. I def applied to Howard and some other HBCUs but when I visited and really asked questions (pertaining to my specific major) I wasnt getting the answers that I was getting from the PWIs. I also had buddies/teachers that had attened BOTH PWIs and HBCUs- and they were honestly in agreement that the PWIs that I applied to ranked HIGH and far above the HBCUs. The connections, facilities etc were high above what Howard, Clark, and other HBCUs that I applied to were providing. I even followed some of my friends around for a few days to really see what it was about- at BOTH types of schools. Im just being honest- I didnt feel any more or less black, but I DID feel deprived in comparing the facilities. That was my issue. I went to very diverse HS and have friends from all walks of life- thats not what I needed. I NEEDED a school that was going to offer me the BEST. I even got a little upset with a lot of my visits at HBCUs because I would hear speechs claiming to be the BEST yet my friends who actually went there would tell me the truth. Many speakers at Howard YELLED that they were the MECCA of black education. What?! Is that JUST within HBCU’s or overall- and that was my question. I dont wanna be the best JUST within the black community. I need it OVERALL. I cant put that on my resume. Especially if at schools like Catholic University, University of MD, and GW (all in DC area) they are offering full engineering libraries and internships with companies like Clark and TII by Soph year??
I dont have a problem with HBCU what so ever- but I want them to consider themselves on the SAME level, I want them to UP their facilities. I needed more…and thats just me-and it def paid off because I was already hired and working in my field by Junior year- as oppose to my best friend- who was at Howard U- in the same exact major- who ended up coming to my school across town to use our lab and our facilities. So I dunno- they say you dont know what you have UNTIL you know what else is out there- and because I had friends at HBCUs and PWI- it rang clear.
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I went to an HBCU for 1 year before going on to a PWI. Generally the faculty was excellent, but too many of the students didn’t belong in college at all.
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